Ep #16: Changing How Coaches Think About Money with Brittany Deer

Hi, this is Lindsay Dotzlaf and you are listening to Mastering Coaching Skills, episode 16.

To really compete in the coaching industry, you have to be great at coaching. That’s why every week, I will be answering your questions, sharing my stories, and offering tips and advice so you can be the best at what you do. Let’s get to work.

Hey friends. I am so happy to be back here with you today. A couple things, First of all, today I have such a fun interview with my friend and client Brittany Deer. She is a money mindset coach and we are going to talk about all things money.

Brittany is so inspiring. And her story is pretty powerful. So, stay tuned and I hope you enjoy this interview. Also, if you are listening in real time, my mastermind Coaching Masters is currently open for enrollment. If it’s something that you’ve been thinking about or that you’re interested in, make sure to head over to my website, limdsaydotzlafcoaching.com for more information. Here we go. Let’s talk to Brittany.

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Lindsay: Hello.

Brittany: Hello.

Lindsay: How are you today?

Brittany: Pretty phenomenal. It’s Tuesday.

Lindsay: Do you love Tuesdays?

Brittany: I do. I have Coaching Masters.

Lindsay: I didn’t even pay you to say that right at the beginning.

Brittany: I always look forward to Tuesdays. I have a few clients on Tuesdays. Tuesdays are a good day.

Lindsay: I love it. Okay. Introduce yourself. We just started talking. Who are you and what do you do?

Brittany: I am Brittany Deer and I am a money mindset coach for coaches. I help coaches build a relationship with money that they love so that they can get back to building the business.

Lindsay: How did you get into that? Tell me – just take me all the way back, like, “I was two years old…” the whole story.

Brittany: I was two years old?

Lindsay: I want you to talk about your journey because I feel like it is kind of unique and your journey is very powerful of how you came into this niche and decided that this is what you wanted to do. So, I just want them to have a little context, the people listening, of how you got here.

Brittany: Yeah, of course, it’s evolved over the past few years. But it started with – my relationship with money, I knew, was never what I always wanted it to be. So, I always had this intuition, knowing that I was made for more, I could make more, all of these things. And for, gosh, a decade or more, I searched externally, finding that I would go from job to job. And I knew what I was capable of. But I did not really address my relationship with money because I didn’t eve – I wasn’t shown that or didn’t know that at the time.

And so, I was on social media one day and was scrolling and seeing someone that I had went to grade school with and I’d known her for most of my life. And I was like, “Wow…” and I haven’t seen her in 10-plus years. And I was like, my first thought was, “She knows something that I do not know.” Which you and I both know is Stacey Boehman. And I was like, what in the world? She knows something.

So, I was super-intrigued. And at that exact time in my life, my husband and I were really rocky, about to get divorced because of money. Finances were always a struggle for us. We just could not figure it out in terms of together or separate or anything. We meshed two different upbringings and we had been married for about 10 years at that point. So, our house was in foreclosure. It was just a mess in terms of personal finances.

So, I see Stacey and I’m like, “What does this person know that I don’t know?” And I just reached out and from there I would say the rest is history. But at the time, she was transitioning from coaching MLM people to just business coaching. And I didn’t have a business and I definitely was not interested in having a business. I just had this – I think my other dominant thought was, “I have nothing to lose.”

I had tried almost everything, done elimination processes, we had tried multiple counseling sessions in terms of our marriage, in terms of money and how to handle that. And nothing had worked. And so, I got on the phone with her and essentially, she was just like, “Well, I can help you.” And she didn’t require me to have a business or anything at the time.

And I went through – I think the first time I hired her was, like – I can’t remember if it was a six-month or 12-month time, but again, my house was in foreclosure, so I had to figure out a way to pay her and still be able to figure out how we were going to be able to save our home, save our marriage, all of this stuff.

And I went and got a job at Starbucks. I think a lot of people may recall that. And that’s how I paid her. I would get off of my nine to five job. I would go straight to Starbucks. And all of my Starbucks money went straight to coaching to help me figure out my own – and a lot of that was building my own relationship with myself. Because I already knew what I was capable of, but maybe just more honing in on it and implementing it. And so, from there, I just knew that that had to be shared with the world.

And another year went by when she had to – you and her actually – had to coach me on having a business, and pertaining to money. It was like I wanted to and I knew that it was super-important to me. But I really resisted it and I also felt like eventually that I would be doing a disservice to all of the women out there that struggle with money when I had figured this out if I did not go and have a business specifically around money.

So, since 2017, it’s evolved into that. And I would say, from there, I coached just women in general and business owners. And now I coach specifically coaches. First, I attracted mostly coaches in the beginning. But now, I really believe that coaches can change the world and I love this industry so much that I do not want any coach out there struggling with money to where they can’t build a business. They became a coach because they want to help people and I don’t want money to ever be the reason that they’re not out there helping people.

Lindsay: I love that. And you and talk about this a lot, about how we have had different thoughts throughout our lives about money. And we were talking about it right before we hopped on here. And I’m curious, what do you think – I’ve heard this question before of how would a coach know if they need to hire, or if they should, or if they want to hire you, for example, or a money mindset coach versus they’re just scared to build their business? How would they know? If somebody’s listening and they’re like, “How do I know if I need that or if I just need to learn how to make money?”

Brittany: Yeah, so my first answer on that is looking at your dominant emotions when it comes to money. And you can do it in your personal life. You can do it around your business. So, what are you feeling when you are – we’ll use this example – when you are in the money part of a consultation, how are you feeling? When you are thinking about building your business and thinking about the actual money goal, how are you feeling about it?

So, my dominant emotions most of the time, growing up and in the beginning, were I was very overwhelmed. It felt like pressure. It felt stressful. It was exhausting, money just felt all of those negative emotions and I had to teach myself how to feel how I want to feel. So, calm, certain.

A big thought I had was I never wanted money to be the reason that I wasn’t building my business or wasn’t focused. I just didn’t want it to be the reason for anything because it’s never the reason. It’s always our thoughts about it. But we just tend to blame money and it’s a very normal thing that society does is we just tend to blame money. So, I would say the first thing, if you aren’t feeling confident and certain and calm when your brain has thoughts about money, that’s how you know if you need money mindset coaching.

Lindsay: I love it. What would you say are the main – like, when you say pay attention to the way you feel when you think about money, what are the main top emotions that people feel when they hire you to work with them? Or even their thoughts. What are the thoughts that are different for someone who would hire a money mindset coach? What are the thoughts that they’re having or the emotions that they’re having that might be different than someone, for example, who’s just building their business and feeling a little scared about building their business, which I think is different than what we’re talking about?

Brittany: Yeah, there’s for sure a difference in that, “I teach you how to make the money,” versus the actual money thoughts, like the thoughts and the emotions that come behind it. I would say that their emotions are frustration. They’re overwhelmed. They might feel a little defeated. Those are probably the top three. And their thoughts are, “This is harder than I thought. Money is hard. I’m never going to make money.” They have thoughts around their offer, so whatever their offer is, or their pricing. And part of my work of connecting that is their value with the dollar amount.

So, their brain says, you know, “I want to charge X dollars.” And then their brain also has lots and lots of thoughts from just deciding on a number. So, I would say that those are probably the top emotions and top thoughts that come from coaches.

Lindsay: And then, how do you see those things play out in their actions? So, what might they be doing or not doing in their businesses because of these thoughts and the feelings that they’re having about money?

Brittany: Yeah, they tend to run or avoid them or try to suppress them so that they think that’s going to just go away until…

Lindsay: Like if I can just make the money and this will all just be gone, right?

Brittany: Correct, yeah, so if I just keep focusing on making money and having more money, then these aren’t going to come back up. And so, I see them thinking that – just more of that thinking that money is going to fix the problem. So, if I can just figure that out, then everything will be amazing.

Lindsay: Let’s say they start their business, maybe they make a little bit of money, then what happens? At some point, they realize, “Oh wait, hold on, I thought that when I make this money, everything was just going to start getting easier and it’s not.”

Brittany: Yes, so I could share personal experience of that as well. But that’s very common. It’s very common, especially if they are in the very beginning of the business when they’re trying to build it and they’re just trying to make as much money as they possibly can. It’s very normal. But what I help them with is really managing that so that it doesn’t become this money block that continues the rest of building the business.

So, in my example, I think it was around $50,000 to $75,000 in my business, that happened and my brain kind of went a little crazy and I allowed it. And I could see it because I had already done so much work. But I had never made that much money in any job. I have combined because I always had multiple jobs. But in one job, I had never made that much money. And I also had never done that on my own, as my own business, as my own company.

And so, my brain really freaked out and what I learned through that is really how to help them manage it, even on a smaller level. So, sometimes, that happens when my clients have their first few-thousand-dollar month or they make their first, whatever, $500 because they’re not used to that, and walking alongside of them and helping them along the way really sets them up for the future to where it’s not going to be this major block in the future when they’re building their business.

What I tend to see is money is an evolving relationship. It’s something that you’re continuously investing in. And you grow at the capacity that you want to grow with it. So, no matter what level you’re at, there’s always money mindset work to be done. Some people, it just takes a little bit more effort than others and I’ve always been inspired by you because of that. It’s just been – I don’t want to use the word easier, so to say. But I know it’s never been the reason for you building a very successful business.

Whereas for me, I just have to build that relationship and nurture it and really focus on it because it has always been – I mean, it’s been more of my story having a struggle with money relationship than it’s not. Like, I’m only a few years in terms of having a totally different relationship versus what I had for the majority of my life.

Lindsay: Yeah. Where do you think – a lot of the clients that come to you, do you think that that’s kind of where it starts, that they have money stories from when they were young and they’ve just carried them with them this whole time and they have never learned how to work through it or get on the other side of it, and now it just shows up in a different way?

Brittany: Yeah, for sure. Because sometimes, it takes us just to look at them and say, “I didn’t even realize that I had this part of my story.” So, one of the ones that I grew up with was I have to work really hard and I have to work a lot of hours to make a good living.

And I could kind of see that, that I inherited that and it wasn’t a choice. But I also felt like I don’t know how to get rid of that. How do I not identify with that? I didn’t really want to. But it’s definitely something that I learned in my childhood. And so, addressing those in a way that they can see them but also it just doesn’t have to be a problem, so it’s very easy for me to see that once I thought it and say, like, I just don’t identify with that and I don’t have to do that. And now, I’ve kind of built my business around how many hours I want to work and how I want to work and I just think there’s a difference between hustling and hard work. And I think that when you notice that you don’t have to hustle, that you can really produce the same results or just as amazing results.

Lindsay: What do you think – so, that thought, “I have to work hard for money,” that was also something I was taught for sure, which was really interesting because for some reason, in the two of us, it rooted itself differently. Although I will say kind of the hustle and the overworking is something that I, early on, had to really work on how to balance family and money and working and how to just kind of balance it all without thinking, “I have to work hard at all of it and it’s all going to be terrible and hard.”

But it definitely showed up, just in a different way for me. But if you don’t mind, however much detail you want to go into, but can you think of other things you were taught about money when you were young? I think it’s so fascinating to think about it.

Brittany: It is very fascinating to think about, of course. It’s one of my favorite things to just listen to what other people think about money. And I always tell my clients, one of the best things you can do for yourself is to listen when people talk about money. Just listen and see where your brain goes. Because it’s just interesting.

Money conversation is everywhere. If you start to look for it, it is in so many conversations on your day-to-day basis. So, I love that and I was always very intrigued by it…

Lindsay: Especially as entrepreneurs, right?

Brittany: Yes, for sure. But I think about – we camp and sometimes, when we’re sitting around the campfire having campfire talk, money comes up and it’s just so fascinating to me. But some of the childhood beliefs were really that money was hard. I was going to have to work really hard for it, that I would have to sacrifice something. That was another one. Like, I was going to have to sacrifice time with my children if I wanted more money or if I wanted to just have a different life with money, then I was going to have to sacrifice an area.

Another thing was that a little bit of scarcity in terms of how I was raised. I was raised by a blended family and so my mom, for quite some time, it was just me and her. And I saw her work so hard to provide for us. And it kind of did a little bit of both things. It really has helped me in taking ownership over my own story and my own relationship with money. But it also is like, is this how life has to look? Does it have to be this way?

And I would say, a few years ago, I was at that point where I was like, “Oh, I might be a single mom,” which would emphasize my other belief that it’s so hard, that I would have to work hard to make money. So, I think we have these childhood beliefs that also feed off of each other. And when we go into business, those definitely can play a part in – it’s like a filter. It’s a filter that our business is run through. And sometimes, we just don’t even consciously know that that’s the filter.

Because for me, I had lived that for so long and it was, yeah, just a filter that we don’t consciously recognize until we really start exploring, “Okay, hang on a second, I’m in charge here. I get to decide what I think, what I feel around money,” and you really can. I know this because I did it. But you really can create a whole other relationship or identity with money if you want to. It’s completely available to you. But I think it is important to look at where your past is from. And for me, the easiest way to move very quickly, that’s another thing, that I did move very quickly in terms of my money growth, was because I just kind of looked them in the face and was like, that doesn’t have to be a part of me anymore in my future. But it also was a part of how I was raised and I really appreciate it now because it’s led me here. And not having resentment towards it or making it a problem, even.

Lindsay: Yeah, one thing that stood out to me in what you were just saying that is probably different than the way – you know, I said we had the similar thought we have to work hard for money. But I was definitely not taught, or at least my interpretation of what I was taught about money, I guess, is not that I would have to sacrifice – because that kind of has the connotation of, “And money is bad.” Like, you’re going to have to work really hard for it and you’re probably going to want it because you need it for all the things in life. But it’s going to take time from your family and your whatever. And so, that undertone of that in your thinking and what you were raised with its like, “And it’s kind of bad.” So, it’s like a necessary evil, right?

Brittany: Yeah. I would say too, sometimes I see women want – coaches specifically will come and they’re like, “Well, I already know that it’s okay to want more money.” So, they say stuff like that. But then there’s all these underlying thoughts that aren’t actually contributing to that belief of actually wanting more money. And so, it’s just interesting because in our industry, we do emphasize so much on money and from a totally different standpoint from the majority of people talk about it. It’s a totally different look onto it.

It’s not a bad thing. It’s this amazing tool that we have and it’s very much talked about. But then the actual background noise or thoughts, so to say, aren’t supporting that they actually know that to be truth. And the background noise is actually the filter that they’re looking through when they’re building their business. Instead of like, “Oh, this actually isn’t a problem that I do want more money and I want it because I want to build my family and teach my family that it’s okay to have more money,” all these things.

I had a client one time that I had put out a post that said, “It’s okay that you want more money. There’s nothing wrong with you because you want more money.” And she hired me just from me saying that and giving herself permission that it was okay. Because I don’t think that that’s a normal discussion that we just go around saying, that it’s okay.

Lindsay: And it’s okay – and I think this kind of plays into what you were saying a second ago – not only is it okay. But it’s okay and you don’t have to do it while also being the best mom. I’m not saying be a bad mom, but you know what I’m saying. You don’t have to say, “Yes, I can definitely build this business, as long as I still take care of my family, do all the things I would normally do, I’m not going to change anything until I make money.”

That’s how I see it show up, like, I have to make the money first because I couldn’t possibly just want money and want to build my business and make money, and make my family uncomfortable by saying I need help with the kids or I need to go to preschool. That’s how it showed up in my life. But for me, it was like, “Oh yeah, this is happening. My kids are going to preschool. I have no thoughts about it,” right?

But I just see it show up that way for a lot of coaches in particular who it’s like they want to make the money before they make any of the hard decisions growing their business.

Brittany: Yeah, for sure. And I did the complete opposite of that. And I think the biggest thing is just being willing to experiment with it. I’m not saying you have to do that, to make the hard decisions ahead of time. Just be willing to experiment with it because that’s exactly what led me here, was experimenting with it and knowing what I wanted to do and how I can implement that.

I think that when I left my corporate job the reason – I wasn’t making any money. I actually had just started my business, I think. I left in August. I started in June. And I had made zero money and we were just fresh out of saving our house and saving our marriage, within six to eight months or something. And it was like, I’m doing this because I want to get my kids on and off the bus. That’s all I wanted to do. And that was kind of the first decision I made where money wasn’t a factor. It wasn’t a reason.

And I made a lot of decisions after that. And I mean, I’m using that very simple example. But I made the hard decision of money is not going to be the reason that I’m not doing this. and then trusting that I was just going to figure it out because, you know, clearly we have to have money if we want to provide. But I just trusted that I was going to figure it out. It was just never the reason that I didn’t do something.

Lindsay: And I think you just kept figuring it out. So you’re like, “Here’s just more proof.” Because if we go back to where you started this, where you’re like, “My house was in foreclosure, my relationship with my husband was not amazing.” It’s like all the things. And what I’ve always loved so much about you is that I met you sometime shortly after the beginning of all that. But just watching you, I’ve always been so impressed by, somehow, you’ve managed to – it’s like you decide what’s important and you do those things and also invest in yourself and in your business.

And you have found a balance that I think a lot of people, I’ve seen, have trouble doing both. Like, “I need to make money so I can save my house, my marriage, my whatever.” And to be clear, you worked on something, you worked on something else, you worked on something else. It’s not like overnight you just changed everything. You just committed to the work.

Brittany: I would say it was a full year, probably 18 months. So, it took me from, if you want to say start to finish, from the first day that I was introduced to coaching, to the day that I decided to have a business and building was probably around 12 months to 18 months. But I knew that I had to change my own life before – I mean, a business wasn’t in my forefront at the time. But I knew that I had to change my own life for something more than just changing my own life with money.

Just like anyone else, my children were a huge drive for that. I did not want to teach them what I had been taught. I did not want to repeat a generational money problem. I wanted it to be very different and I moved very fast because that was so motivating to me. And the way that, when we talk about my marriage, the way that we manage that and heal that is I just use the same exact tools.

I didn’t do anything differently. But the way that I thought about money is I used those exact thinkings to think that way about my husband and about my marriage. And they definitely transferred for me. So, you know, money is hard, marriage is hard. It was just a very back and forth transferrable thinking. And I also felt the same emotions when it came to both of those areas of my life. And they are both very, very important to me. And so, I knew that I was going to have to do that work for something greater than myself.

Lindsay: Yeah, what do you think – so when I think about money, the way I think about it is money itself is great, I guess. It’s neutral. The only reason we want money is to feel a certain way or to think a certain way. Even if it’s like, “I want to have these experiences in my life,” it all comes back to because I want to feel a certain way.

Brittany: 100%.

Lindsay: How did you learn – so, before you were making money in your business, how did you learn to start creating that for yourself? Because like we said earlier, a lot of people think, when I have the money, then I can feel calm, for example, or I can feel adventurous because I get to travel more, you know, whatever it is, however they’re wanting to feel, can you give the people listening just a small clue of how you were able to start creating that for yourself to create the results before, instead of trying to do it backwards, which is what most people try to do?

Brittany: Yeah, the easiest thing is finding sufficiency exactly where you are. So, something very basic that I would do when I was working in my corporate job, I would be sitting at my little cubicle desk and I would just ask myself, Brittany, do you have a roof over your head? Yes. Brittany, do you have a vehicle? Mind you, which is a luxury, not a need. And I would be like, yes. Brittany, do you have water? Yes. Do you have food?

I would just take my brain back to so basic, to remind myself of what I did have. And you can continue with that list. Brittany, do you have healthy children? Yes. And just finding sufficiency exactly where you are, I think is the most basic, most simple. And all it takes to find this sufficiency is by asking yourself very simple questions like that. Because when you ask yourself a question like that and then you feel the emotion in your body, then your brain gets like, I don’t know, maybe a dopamine hit or something that happens where it’s like, “Oh, I really am okay. It’s okay.”

And then, once you start there, then you can increase it. You can keep increasing it from there. So, that’s like the most simplest basic, but what I see is that is the hardest for a lot of coaches.

Lindsay: Why do you think that is?

Brittany: I think it is because, in the forefront is, “I want to make money. I want my business to be successful.” And yes, you do. But you have to take your brain back to the basics. And it’s kind of like the walking analogy, like a child. When they’re walking, they take one step and then they wobble a little bit and then they fall and then they get back up. And you kind of have to do that. But every day, we don’t need help walking for the most part.

But say you hurt your leg and you’re like, “Damn, my leg’s really hurting. Well, maybe I should get up and move it a little bit.” We don’t do that in terms of our money. We don’t take it back to the basics and start questioning ourselves, “Maybe I should try this. Maybe I should see exactly where I am right now. It is really okay. It may not be the ideal place that I want to be or the place that I want to stay, but I’m okay.”

And I think you can do that at every single level. So, no matter how much money you make, you can be like, wait, take yourself back to the basics and just find sufficiency exactly where you’re at.

Lindsay: I love that you said that because that leads perfectly actually into my next question. You and I have talked about this and I always find it so fascinating because I know your story very well and I’ve heard you tell it and it’s so inspiring and amazing. And so, I just assumed, when you started doing this, that most of your clients had a story more like you and you are teaching them how to have a different relationship with money because they’re not used to having money or they’ve just never been able to think about having money because they didn’t. That was kind of my thought.

And you can I kind of have that in common. When I was young, I also lived with a single mom for quite a while. And we did not have money and I watched her work really hard. So, that’s also my story. But in talking with you, what I’ve learned is that you also work with coaches who do have quite a bit of money and they still have – they might not be making it in their coaching business. But for some other reason – they already have money. Maybe their spouse makes a lot of money. Maybe they have made a lot of money now they’re transitioning into coaching. Maybe their family has money. Tell me about that because I think that is – it’s such good proof of, “Wait a minute, it actually is our thoughts that create our results. Not the circumstance.”

Brittany: Yeah, I love so much when we find the proof. Recently, I was talking to a client and we were like, “Oh yeah, it is our thoughts.” Yeah, I do. I have clients that have inherited a lot of money. I have clients that have come from family-owned business, so they grew up in an entrepreneurial household and so they become an entrepreneur themselves.

And what is so fascinating to me is on either side, the thoughts and the emotions, for the most part, the exact same. And of course, I’m no psychiatrist or psychologist, but I have always been fascinated by that because your and I story versus I have a client that has hundreds of thousands of dollars, makes, I don’t know, right under $100,000 in her own business and then also has an inheritance and also her husband makes lots of money, so there’s just lots of money in general. And those thoughts are very similar to what I experienced at no money.

And when I say no money, like, I always had money. Just when I was losing my house and all of that, very similar thinking. And there’s just so many places that that could come from. It could be a story that they made up in their own mind or it could be how they were raised. If they grew up in an entrepreneurial household, you have to – I you want to be an entrepreneur, you’ve got to work really hard, you know, all those things.

So, there’s the childhood. There’s the story that we kid of create in our brain unconsciously that we don’t know that we’re creating around money. And then there is also society, what we hear other people talk about or, you know, what the news says or what the world says about money. And we just don’t actually realize how much our brain grasps onto that and takes that as, like, “Oh, maybe that’s true, Maybe I should think that way or maybe I should lean that way instead of leaning more into the, like, “Hang on a second, I’m creating my own relationship, this is what I want it to look like,” and just staying in that lane. But yeah, on those two opposite ends of the spectrum, the thinking is very similar, which is very fascinating.

Lindsay: I see this play out in my own life sometimes where – and this isn’t some deep-seated stuff that I’ve had to work through, but I notice it. So, for example, before when I was first building my coaching business, I invested a lot of money in coaches. I invested a lot of money in my business. And it totally freaked my husband out but he was onboard. And I would see the number in my bank account and I would know, like, on the first I’m going to pay my mortgage. And so, I would always have to go in and see how much money is in there and is it going to clear? Because it was set up to pay automatically. And sometimes, I’d have to turn that off because I’m like, “I don’t think that’s going to work.”

And so, there was a minimum threshold of what I was comfortable with. It was very low. Like, as long as I’m within $100 when all the money comes out, we’re going to be fine and there’ll be more money coming in. Luckily, my husband had a job and got paid every two weeks or every other Friday or whatever it was at the time. And so, that was predictable. But I would let it get to this comfort zone.

Now, I’ve made a lot more money. I have a lot more money in my bank account. And I still have this threshold that, when I see it, I’m like, “Whoa, how did we get under that?” And it’s the exact same thoughts, the exact same feelings, the number is so different.

Brittany: Exactly. And I would say I’m 100% the same way. My threshold was like – I mean, I’ve got a dollar in there, totally fine.

Lindsay: As long as it’s not negative, we’re good.

Brittany: Yeah. And it’s definitely not anywhere near that now. And some people call that your money temperature or your money ceiling. And yes, it does grow as you grow and build your relationship. But what’s so interesting about that is because we have felt the discomfort of it being extremely low. So, when we look at that number, that number is – we automatically know that it’s neutral and then we can kind of work through it from that point.

And of course, there’s that thought in our mind, when you hit rock bottom, there’s clearly no other way up or way out other than up, right? So, I still know what it feels like to have – I know what it feels like to have negative, but I also know what it feels like to have very little. And I also know what it feels like to have a lot. And I think that it is important to just remember that it never has to be a problem, no matter what that number actually is.

It’s kind of what we were talking about with pricing, when people come to me and they’re like, “I don’t know what price my packages at,” or, “I’m having drama about charging this much.” And it’s like, their brain came up with a number, it sees a number, and then there’s all of these thoughts about this actual number. And it’s the same thing with bank accounts. I have people that obsessively check their bank account or check to see if the client has paid yet, like this obsessive behavior around a number…

Lindsay: That’s probably such a good indicator for when someone should hire a money mindset coach, is when you are obsessively checking not just your bank account, but like you said, checking to see, have they paid yet? Have they paid yet? Okay, but have they paid yet? Because when I see my clients do that, especially previously when I was working with a bunch of one-on-one clients, when they were doing that, they were so distracted, waiting for the money that was supposed to come in. It was totally stopping them from making money.

Brittany: 100%. And you can correct me if I’m wrong, but I just don’t ever remember doing that. I just don’t ever remember obsessively checking to see if they paid. If anything, I was obsessively, like, “I’ve got to keep going. Next person…” I definitely had the hustle energy in the beginning. And I still have tendencies.

Lindsay: Don’t you think that’s because you did this work first before you started growing a business at all. So, you already did so much work on your thoughts about money and can you imagine if you had just decided to start a business when your house was foreclosed and all those things, can you imagine all the thoughts you would have had?

Brittany: Oh my gosh, I know that people can’t see me, but holy-moly that’s a no. Like, no way. No way.

Lindsay: I bet some people that are listening are doing that, maybe not in that exact house in foreclosure, marriage is falling apart, like actual rock bottom. But whatever their comparison to that would be, feeling that same way, and then trying to ask people for money for coaching.

Brittany: Yeah, that was the other thing, that did not feel authentic to me. And I am a huge believer in trying to stay in that as often as I can, just that authenticity of I could have never asked somebody for money from the place that I was in. That felt so awful to me.

And I think that’s kind of why I did hustle in that first year to 18 months, was because I wanted it so badly. And then, once I had kind of decided in my mind that I was like, “Oh, I think I want to do this,” I think I want to be a coach, then it was even more like, I do want to hustle to get my own story where I want it to be so that it felt just very authentic and very true to me when I got people on the phone and asked them, or told them – of course, they were coming to me for the services. But this is what I charge for this. it’s never felt inauthentic or, I don’t know what the word is, maybe wrong in that scenario or that part of the consult.

And so, I just stay true to that and really, I think I teach my clients that too because they want the business so badly, they want it to be very successful, but underneath all of that is just a deep desire to help them with whatever niche that they’re in.

Most of my clients were equally as passionate about their niche as I am, and so no matter what it is, it’s like, okay, that’s such a driver for me and for them. Like I said, it makes me emotional when I think about coaches struggling with money because I don’t even want it to be a problem. And it’s the same way for my clients.

And even though money is a problem for them, they just kind of want to break through those barriers and those walls so that it’s not the problem that’s in the way of them serving their clients on a weight-loss level or serving their clients on – I have business coaches as well. Whatever their niche is. And so, I think that’s just a huge driver for me, is just staying authentic to that money piece. And you know, I’m always doing the work.

Lindsay: Yes you are. I love that so much about you. And I want to clear something up because we were talking about this when we started recording. And we talked about it actually today in my mastermind. And what we were discussing is that sometimes, the way we’re talking about this money work and the way we’re describing it, I think sometimes it can sound like, “Oh man, this is going to be heavy and deep. It’s deep work and I have to pull up all these thoughts from my terrible childhood,” like all the heavy things. Is that how you work with your clients? Is that what it feels like to them?

Brittany: No, no, no, no. Because I wouldn’t have done it, right? I wouldn’t have done it if it felt awful because I already felt awful. When I just thought of the word money, it felt awful. So, there is a piece of it where I help them create because fun is, you know – everybody thinks of fun differently and what’s fun to you – I could talk about money all day long, all of the things money not just making a lot of it. I like to talk about all of the pieces.

Lindsay: I’m just envisioning you like, “Tell me your worst money stories ever. Let’s start there.” Is that what you do?

Brittany: Negative. No. I would probably run in the beginning for sure. No, but finding the way for them, that is a huge important piece of my work, is finding the way for them that works for them. Because money is already inflicted in so many external ways, like I said, childhood, society, other people. And so, it’s super-important to me to help them discover what that looks like for them, by them deciding, by them saying, “This is what I want. This is how I want to feel. This is how I want to think. This is what I want it to look like.” We get very visional, so to say…

Lindsay: Is that a word?

Brittany: I don’t know. I just made it up.

Lindsay: I know what it means. We’ll pretend it’s a word.

Brittany: Yeah, like creating images in your mind around what it would look like. And so yes, you have to make it fun and you have to make it exciting, or it is going to be this daunting thing that – I mean, nobody’s signing up to do something that they’re like, “Oh this sounds awful but I guess I’m going to do it because I know I need to do this to build my business,” or whatever it is.

Lindsay: Right, it’s not like a punishment. Because here’s one reason I think it’s important to point that out. I know from talking to you and I know from a lot of my personal friends and also clients that I’ve had, is that a lot of people who experience this who have thoughts about money that are deeply rooted in scarcity have tried lots of things.

Brittany: 100% they’re always seekers.

Lindsay: They’ve tried all the programs. We won’t name names, but all the people’s things…

Brittany: Yep, they’ve tried it all. They’ve tried all of the steps to teach them how to make money, they’ve tried the steps on how to eliminate debt. They’ve tried the steps on everything…

Lindsay: They’ve eaten like beans and rice for a year straight or something.

Brittany: Yeah, we’re not going there. Actually, I’ve seen something recently from that said person that was like, “Money is finite.” And I’m like, “Isn’t there supposed to be an I-N in front of that word, infinite?”

Lindsay: That’s amazing.

Brittany: So, yeah, I think that…

Lindsay: Let’s be really clear. Not that those things are terrible. For the right people, they’re perfect. But I think of it as, if you are an obsessive dieter who never gets results and you have that unhealthy relationship with your body, going on the starvation diet is not going to be your best plan. It’s going to feel terrible. Everything about it is going to be miserable and it’s probably not going to work. Or if it does, you’re going to be miserable anyway so why not just, like, have debt and be miserable?

Brittany: Yes, that’s so true. Exactly. It’s, you know, the complete opposite of that. I want to make it this – yes, it’s important and I’m not saying that it’s not going to be hard, because you are going to have to feel some things that you’re probably already feeling. You just don’t know it or you don’t associate it with that.

Lindsay: But all of us have those one or two areas of growth that we’re like, “Yep, this is my thing that’s just going to be a little uncomfortable. That’s okay.”

Brittany: Yeah, but I just always ask myself – and I still ask myself to this day – why do I do this? Why do I want to keep evolving in my money relationship? Well, my first answer is because I want to do this for something bigger than myself. I want to do this. I want to go ahead of my clients. But also my family. It’s really important to me that they see that I’m doing this work. And when I say this work, I’m actively investing in my money relationship.

It’s no different to me in my household that my children see how much I’m investing in my relationship with my husband. I literally don’t say it’s one or the other. You know, me investing in myself, me investing in my money relationship, me investing in my parenting, I want them to see that and money being the tool that’s going to help me achieve all of those is just very important for me so that I can go ahead of my clients as well.

Lindsay: Okay, this has been so fun. And I’m going to wrap it up. But I have a couple of questions. Three, I think. One is, I’m going to tell you the quickest story about my daughter Charlie. And I want to hear your opinion as a parent on how you would handle this, because it has to do with money. I don’t think I’ve told you. Hopefully not because you’re going to be like, “Oh my gosh, I can’t believe that happened.” Because I’ve just been thinking about it ever since.

And then, I want to tell everybody, you have been my client for a while. You are not doing Coaching Masters for a second round, so I want you to tell them, if they’re thinking about joining, why they should, what you love or hate about it, and what your thoughts are. And then, we’ll end with you telling them how to find you, how you work with your clients, whatever you want to tell them.

Okay, so, my daughter is in virtual school, Charlie, you know Charlie. Brittany and I are friends and she knows my kids. But for anyone listening, Charlie is 11. And so, she was on a Zoom call and they were doing math. And I don’t know why this came up, but she said, on a Zoom call to her whole class and teachers, “Yeah, my mom made a million dollars last year.” And first of all, not true. She’s probably confused with my goal for this year.

I don’t know where that came from. But we do talk – I try at least to talk openly with my kids about money because I don’t want them to have shame around money. I want them to come to me and ask any questions about money. It’s not a taboo topic. My husband happened to also hear and his immediate reaction was, “Don’t ever… and I was like, “Don’t say that to her. Because he was about to say his kind of story, and still is, it’s so interesting. We think about money very differently. Me growing a business has been pretty uncomfortable for him. But he was going to say, “Don’t ever talk about that. Don’t ever say that.”

Now, although my reaction was different and I just, in general, like, “Don’t say those words to her. We don’t need to shame her for talking about money.” But I was still like, is that an appropriate thing to say to – you know, do we need to be telling the whole class and the teachers that mom made a million dollars? I just have mixed thoughts about it.

And Charlie and I talked about it too. She, of course, didn’t get in trouble. I was like, “Oh, actually I didn’t. I made like half of that, so whatever, close, cool.” But in her mind, she thinks it’s cool, but she’s like, “Yeah, I made a million dollars.” I’m just curious what your opinion is.

Brittany: So, my first thoughts are, this is how we know that our money beliefs start at a very young age. And she meant nothing by that. It was probably a very honest, neutral, innocent thing.

Lindsay: Yeah, she could have been saying, “I have $5 in my pocket.” No different.

Brittany: Yes, and also, I think that she probably already believes that you’re that person. Because I know how she is. But in terms of saying that out to the world…

Lindsay: I act like that person, so…

Brittany: Yeah, but in terms of saying that out to the world, I think that’s what the problem is. I think that we can say those things and there not be shame or it be a problem, or that we have to hush somebody. It’s just we – when I’m talking about we I’m talking humans – have created that there’s things that we don’t talk about. And how much money we make is one of them.

And I am that person that comes into the room and I’m like, “Let’s talk about all the money.” Let’s talk about it because when you surround yourself with people that do think differently, you can learn something by it. It doesn’t always have to be a problem or shameful or offensive. You don’t even have to agree with it. I think that is the other thing is we often think that we have to agree with whatever someone says.

But in terms of my child, I would have been like, “Man, that’s really cool that she believes I can do that.” But yeah, I would just be curious as to where did that come from? What made her say that or think of that? Just more of the context.

It’s funny because I recently had a very similar situation. I don’t even remember exactly what we were talking about, but Easton, my won is 13 and he looked over and he’s like, “Well mom, you already did that.” And we were talking about a six-figure job. And he was like, “Well mom, you already did that.”

And I immediately noticed because there were some people in the room that have very different money beliefs than me and I love these people. And I immediately felt a little bit of, “Oh…” kind of thing myself. And so, I think it’s just important that we notice it. It doesn’t have to be a problem that I felt a little bit squirmy, a little bit uncomfortable when that started a conversation in the room. But I think that is important that we start noticing what the younger generation is saying about money, and the not shaming them or not putting it down because you and I have talked about this before, my husband and I have very different money beliefs.

I know I wish we had all of the time because that is actually one thing I see a lot of coaches as well come to me is if they’re in a relationship or something…

Lindsay: I can’t believe we didn’t talk about that.

Brittany: I know. I can just address it really quickly…

Lindsay: This might have to be a whole other episode…

Brittany: But that doesn’t have to be your story either, even if you’re living with that person. Because Lindsay and I are both very good examples of building successful businesses with very different money beliefs and still living actively right now with someone who thinks very differently. And it’s not a problem. I don’t make his thoughts about it a problem.

But yeah, we do have conversations like that, especially when it involves our children, that like, “Hang on…” Not telling her it’s wrong to do that, but…

Lindsay: I was like, “We can talk about this with her, but don’t freak out and try to shut it down like she’s doing something terrible.” I will share what I noticed about myself. I learned something in that moment because what I wanted to do was get – I had no control because she was on a Zoom call with her class and I noticed myself, like, if I could just hop on that call real quick and qualify it, tell them why, because I work so hard, all the…

Brittany: Like defend yourself.

Lindsay: Yeah. And I just noticed in that moment, it’s cool if I do. But it has to be a good reason. They can’t just think I have a million dollars on my nightstand. And so, it ties back to that belief of, like, you have to work hard for money.

Brittany: Yeah for sure, and raising kids nowadays, it has its challenges for sure and I have boys who love YouTube and all of the people that play, I don’t know, like videogames for a living or something. I don’t really know all of that stuff. But my younger one, he kind of says, “I think I could do that.” And before, I would have been like, “That’s not realistic. Probably not.” You know. And now, I learned, like, “Hang on a second. let me just explain, you could if you wanted to. But do you know what it takes to do that? You’ve got to have a YouTube channel. You’ve got to start your following. It will take you a little bit of time,” just things like that. So, really more exploring it in their brain instead of automatically shutting it down as that’s going to be really hard, you probably shouldn’t do that.

Lindsay: Right, we’ve actually had that conversation with Charlie too because she loves videogames. She’s very good at Rocket League. She plays videogames.

Brittany: I think I know that one. I don’t know the names of all these things.

Lindsay: I’m not a big gamer. My daughter and my husband are. And it’s basically soccer but with cars. And I’m like, “That’s ridiculous. Why? I have so many questions.” But whatever. She’s really – it’s very popular and she’s really god at it. And so, she started saying something similar. And so, I actually looked it up to show her, like, you can’t just be good. To make money doing something like that, this is what your score or whatever is. I don’t remember specifically what stats we were looking up. But it was nowhere close to how you would actually get paid to play videogames. But in her kid mind she’s like, “Oh, I’m just gin got get paid to play videogames.”

Brittany: Exactly.

Lindsay: Okay, so tell them about Coaching Masters, what are your thoughts? Why did you decide to do it a second time? Whatever you want to share.

Brittany: Okay, so I love my answer for this. I’m just saying that ahead of time. Because when I said that I just never wanted money to be the problem or the reason, the same exact thing, I never wanted my coaching ability or a coaching session or anything to be a problem or a reason.

So, the reason that I joined it was because I knew I was a really good coach already. But the first round I had joined it, I guess I had only had my business for – let’s see, my first round was in 2020, so I had went about a year, year and a half with a full-time business. All of 2019. Because that’s when I hit my first six figures.

So, I just never – it’s super-important to me to be able to navigate all of the things for my clients just like my money relationship is super-important to me. And I joined in the second round because I thought, “Okay, six months, total game-changer.” But again, another six months, I literally will never have a problem with any other coaching ability thing. It just will never be a problem in my business ever again.

Lindsay: I do love that answer.

Brittany: Yeah, and I recently said this on a post, because of the name Coaching Masters – I’m a sports guru. I’m not super-into golf, but everybody knows what the Masters is. And I’m like, I mean, I’m the Tiger Woods.

Lindsay: I didn’t even put those, like two and two together. Hilarious. I’m not a huge sports person.

Brittany: Yeah, I’ve always done that. I’ve always been like – I think of the Masters. Only the best are there. and then the best win, which would be Tiger Woods. So, I think of it in that way and I’m just like, it’s never – and I have had that filter, especially all of last year, and into this year, that when I’m on a session, when I’m on a consult, anything, it’s never about my coaching ability.

And I can say that from the depth of everything that I know, that it’s not that. Which eliminates – it’s like, okay, if it’s not money and it’s not this, so it’s like the more you can eliminate, “It’s not my consults, it’s not my marketing,” whatever, the more that you can cross off, the easier it is going to be to build your business.

Lindsay: I’ve never thought about it that way. That’s interesting.

Brittany: Isn’t that fun?

Lindsay: Yeah, that’s really good. Okay, tell them, how do you work with your clients? How can they find you? Anything you want to share.

Brittany: I currently only am offering one on one coaching. They can find me at brittanydeer.com. I’m on Facebook and Instagram under my name, Brittany Deer.

Lindsay: And…

Brittany: You can find me on my podcast…

Lindsay: People always forget this. It’s so interesting. I’m like, we’re on a podcast. People are listening to a podcast. Tell them you have one.

Brittany: Yes, I have Money Mindset Coaching for Coaches Podcast.

Lindsay: As long as they listen to mine first and then yours, good to go.

Brittany: Yes, they for sure need to come listen to mine because I take it to the basics. And I’m a newbie. You can totally catch up I only have 10 episodes.

Lindsay: That’s so fun. Alright, I loved this. Thank you, thank you, thank you.

Brittany: No, thank you. This was a dream.

—

Oh my goodness, that was so much fun. Thank you for joining Brittany and I. I hope you hung in there. I know this was a long one but it’s so fun to talk about money. I’m so glad you listened. If you made it to this point, congratulations. You win. I will talk to you guys next week.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Mastering Coaching Skills. If you want to learn more about my work, come visit me at lindsaydotzlafcoaching.com. That’s Lindsay with an A, D-O-T-Z-L-A-F.com. See you next week.