Hi, this is Lindsay Dotzlaf and you are listening to Mastering Coaching Skills episode 83.

To really compete in the coaching industry, you have to be great at coaching. That’s why every week, I will be answering your questions, sharing my stories, and offering tips and advice so you can be the best at what you do. Let’s get to work.

Hey, coach. Today I just have one more incredible interview for you. I am talking today to one of my clients, Sindy Warren. Sindy is a business coach, she has a program called Side Gig School, which I think is to fun.

We talk a little but about that and we talk about coaching, her experience in Coaching Masters, and for any of you that are newer coaches, we do dive into some business questions. Or even if you’re not a newer coach, but maybe making some changes, we dive into some business questions that some of you all love to ask me sometimes, and I’m just going to redirect you to Sindy because she has the answers for us.

She is so fun, I hope you love this conversation.

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Lindsay: Hello, I am so excited to have you here today. Tell everyone who you are and what you do.

Sindy: Hey, Lindsay. I am so excited to be back. My name is Sindy Warren and I am the founder of Blue Tree Coaching. I’m a life and business coach and I work with people one on one on all the things. And I also have a program called Side Gig School where I help budding entrepreneurs start and or grow side hustles.

Lindsay: I love it. So you take one on one clients and that’s just life coaching, coaching on anything that they want?

Sindy: Totally.

Lindsay: Okay, I always like to just be clear on that because some people have so much drama on that and I don’t ever understand why because I think that so many people just need a nice coach to coach them on whatever they want. So I think that’s amazing.

So let’s just dive in first to kind of how you got into coaching.

Sindy: Yeah, so let’s see, I am in year three of my coaching business. And my background is I’m a lawyer and I graduated from law school in the mid 90s, practiced law, like traditional law firm employment law for almost a decade. And then when my daughter, who is now finishing up her freshman year in college, she’s almost 19, was a baby I kind of hit the pause button and thought this structure isn’t really working for me, so what else can I do?

So I started a human resources consulting business where I used my legal skills to help employers kind of become like litigation proof, or at least have good defenses. And I did that for a very long time.

I think it was my foray into yoga, which also started about 20 years ago, which eventually through a very meandering way led me to coaching. So I was running my own business and very involved as a yoga teacher and a meditation teacher, and I had a book published a few years ago about yoga philosophy.

Lindsay: I did not know that.

Sindy: Yes.

Lindsay: Sorry, I just interrupted you but I had no idea that you had a book.

Sindy: I know, I don’t even talk about it very much because, I don’t know, it feels like a lifetime ago. But it’s sort of a, like I think of it as like a dummy’s guide to yoga philosophy. It’s sort of like an entry point of like what are the eight limbs of yoga? What’s the meaning behind it? Why is it more than just a physical practice and all the things that I have nerded out on myself for the last couple of decades.

Lindsay: Love it.

Sindy: I think through my journey and kind of passion and obsession for yoga philosophy brought me to give a lot of thought and time to the question of like what makes a meaningful life? Which, as you can imagine, eventually lead me to coaching because that’s seemed to be central, a central part of coaching. Like what are we doing here? How do we live our “best” lives? What does that even mean? Why do we care? And then the how.

So I started to dabble into coaching literally thinking, I took a certification course thinking, oh this will be a side gig. That’s how all my things seem to start out and then they take on a life of their own.

Lindsay: Yep.

Sindy: And I kind of fell in love with it. And after my first year of really looking at coaching as my side gig but I was like the lawyer/HR consultant was like my identity really. I dropped that completely and went all in on coaching. Yoga is still my side hustle and always will be.

So I’m a full-time coach now, which required a pretty big identity shift in addition to the logistics of just creating a new business and shutting down another business that was pretty well established. So I think it was just self-inquiry that led me into coaching and then it’s just sort of unraveling a big ball of yarn, it’s so much fun.

Lindsay: So this is fascinating because I, and I told you this right before we started the interview, but I just had, and by the time people hear this they will have already heard the other episode, but I just had another lawyer on who is also my client who is also now a coach.

And it’s so interesting, your stories are so similar because for her, now she has little kids, but she also pivoted a little bit when she had kids because it was like this schedule, like basically I can’t keep this schedule. But instead of yoga she kind of went on this finance journey of like teaching people how to manage their finances and pay off, because she paid off a lot of her debt and whatever. So she kind of went that way.

But it’s so fascinating how identical the journey is and your stories are. So you’ll have to listen to that when it comes out because you’ll get a laugh out of that.

Sindy: I can’t wait to. That’s wild. Yeah, I don’t think my story is super unique to the lawyers who might be listening.

Lindsay: Yeah, why do you think, so that’s something that I said I’ve just always been so curious, like why do you think there are so many, and maybe this isn’t true if we actually look at the overall coaching industry as a whole. But it feels like I tend to attract a lot of lawyers or previous lawyers who are now coaches.

So in my mind I’m like, “There are so many lawyers who are becoming coaches.” Why do you think that that is a thing?

Sindy: First of all, that does not surprise me that you attract the lawyers. And I think it’s so interesting because part of the lawyer path for many is one of being risk averse. And for me it was sort of like well this is just the next right thing to do. You know, I did great on my LSATs which I took because I wasn’t sure what else I wanted to do. And then I got into a great law school and I was like, well obviously that’s just the path.

And coaching is really different, like it requires those of us that at least have our own businesses as coaches to think about risk aversion in a totally different light. There’s not a set path, there’s so many ways to do it.

And that doesn’t exactly answer your question. I think this does, being a lawyer is really hard and being a lawyer and a woman is really hard. And being a lawyer, and a woman, and a mom is really hard. So I think there’s something going on. And obviously it’s not just lawyers,  I know there are a lot of corporate people and doctors who become coaches.

Lindsay: Yes.

Sindy: But there is something about how the traditional workplace is set up that is very hard for moms.

Lindsay: Yeah, I can definitely see that. I know someone who has kind of always been like a serial entrepreneur. And I’ve dabbled in other things, but I feel like I’ve lived 20 lives and just done so many different things. But I’ve always had something that was on my terms. And I’ve always watched my friends and my now colleagues who are working sometimes for other people, and I just think I don’t know how you do it. Like I really, I really don’t.

It just seems so kind of foreign to me of like how does this, like I need the logistics, like how does this work? Because it was hard enough when I could manage my own schedule and my own time having kids, you know, I just don’t even know what it’s like in that world. So it doesn’t surprise me.

And of course, it doesn’t surprise me that it’s so many women, at least that I see, coming into this industry. Which, of course I’m biased, but I think is amazing. And we just get to manage our own schedules and be on our own time.

Sindy: I totally agree. And it is amazing and it’s really hard at times to navigate it.

Lindsay: Definitely, for sure. It’s one of those like pick your hard, right? Like I always say if being an entrepreneur was just simple, easy, everyone would do it because there are perks to it. But there are definitely times where it does feel a little hard.

Sindy: I love that, pick your hard.

Lindsay: Yeah, exactly.

Sindy: It’s going to be hard, just pick your hard.

Lindsay: Yes, I know. For me it’s like I love autonomy, I love to just kind of do my own thing, so that was the hard I picked. And you know, I’m sure if I went the other direction it would just be different kind of hard, but some things would also be easier.

So I’m curious also about the yoga. At what point did you really get into that and was kind of for the same reasons?

Sindy: Yeah, so my yoga journey really began around the same time that I got out of the traditional practice of law. And while I became really interested in yoga philosophy and existential questions et cetera, it started out for more of a pedestrian reason, which was I kept hearing it’s a great workout. And I love a physical challenge.

So it was definitely like the physical practice of yoga that brought me into it. And then I started to notice that I was showing up differently. Like by nature, birth, genetics, whatever, patience does not come easily to me and I can be a bit reactive. And I started to notice that whatever was happening in the yoga room was carrying over into my life in a way that not only felt better to me, but felt better to those I lived with as well.

So I started to become just really curious. Okay, what is this? Why is this happening? I want to know more. And it became just a really fun, interesting, windy journey of, I mean, meaning, I think.

Lindsay: So along that journey you said it kind of led you eventually to coaching. Did you kind of hire a coach for yourself first? Or did you dive right into like the business side of it? I’m always interested in that.

Sindy: No, this is actually a funny story. I was working at a yoga studio, this must have been, I don’t know, a year or two before the pandemic. And I decided I wanted to run like a three-week program called, it was something like living an intentional life. And it was like, you know, I put together with a friend like a book for our clients basically, our students, that was like here’s what you do on day one. And here’s what you do on day two.

So it was a 21-day little journey. And we would meet throughout it and it was just sort of like community building, and introspection, and personal growth, all the things I love. And my girlfriend attended the program with me. And afterwards, I remember this so clearly, we were on a walk and I said, “So what did you think?” And she goes, “You know what, Sindy? It wasn’t your best work.”

And this woman is like my number one fan in life, which is hilarious. And she said, “What you were trying to do was life coaching and you are not a life coach.” I looked at her and I said, “What is life coaching?” She said, “Trust me, go check it out, this is going to be your next thing.”

And this is the same woman who said to me, I remember, like well over a decade ago, I think you should look into becoming a yoga teacher. So she’s kind of that voice in my head.

Lindsay: This is amazing.

Sindy: So I looked into it. I was like, oh, life coaching. Like that was literally the impetus.

Lindsay: I love that story. And I love a friend who can be that honest, that is so fun.

Sindy: You have to have a few of those in your back pocket.

Lindsay: Totally. I think that is great. So you, at that point, now have what, seven jobs? How long have you been just coaching?

Sindy: 2021 was my first year of just coaching.

Lindsay: Okay, I thought that it was recently. You still do some yoga stuff, right?

Sindy: I do, I teach a couple classes a week and that’s about it. I’m not like running around building studios, leading teacher trainings, leading retreats. I’m not doing any of that stuff anymore.

Lindsay: Yes. How has that shift been for you, kind of shifting into just the one thing? Because it kind of sounds like, at least the way you describe it, it sounds like you’ve kind of had a lot of things going on at once until recently.

Sindy: It has been amazing. And also at times kind of terrifying. But, and I’m just going to pull out a Sanskrit word here and then I’ll tell you what it means.

Lindsay: I love it.

Sindy: I know that coaching is my dharma. And dharma is the Sanskrit word for purpose, basically like life purpose. I think the direct translation is sacred duty. But I just have this knowing that this is what I’m meant to do. Yoga is amazing, I’ll always do that on the side. And leaning into that knowing really helped me step away from my other business, which was quite successful.

But it’s certainly not been without its challenges. And I would be lying if I said I didn’t have moments of like, wait, what did I do? Maybe I should have gone and done the other thing, that was so much easier.

Lindsay: Right. And now you have something called the Side Gig School, right?

Sindy: Yeah.

Lindsay: I don’t want to get that wrong. I mean, you still have that?

Sindy: Yeah, that’s what it’s called, yeah.

Lindsay: Okay. As it was coming out of my mouth I was like, okay, I know that’s what it’s called, but she’s still selling that, right? But I just love this because it’s like you working through all of this and kind of having all of these side gigs that have now turned into the real gig set you up perfectly for that, for coaching anyone who is dabbling in a side gig and wants to figure out how to make it work.

Sindy: Yeah, I think that’s right. And I started out with no niche. And I love general life coaching. I mean, I will say that, yes, I’m a general life coach in part, but I also tend to, like you attract lawyers, I tend to attract business people and entrepreneurs.

And the side gig piece just sort of dawned on me in working with my own one on one coach that this is something I’ve sort of figured out again and again how to do with no formal training. And I got really excited about the prospect of helping other people do it because I think side gigs are so fun and they’re so full of possibility. And there’s so much freedom in them, especially for not exclusively, but especially for women and moms.

Lindsay: Why do you think that is? Expand on that a little bit.

Sindy: I think of a side gig as like a baby step into entrepreneurship. And I talk to so many people who say and believe they don’t know enough about, “business” to get started. And I think the thing with side hustles is there’s like no barrier to entry.

If you have an idea, and even if you don’t I can help you find one, and then I can help you turn it into something that brings you passion and fun. And the freedom piece of it is certainly, a couple of the things we’ve already talked about controlling your own schedule, being your own boss, having autonomy, also bringing in another revenue stream for financial freedom.

Lindsay: I love that you said that, my next question was going to be do people, when they come to work with you, when your clients come to work with you for this specifically in the Side Gig School, do they mostly already know what the side gig is? Like it’s already established and they want your help growing it or whatever, making more money from it, or whatever it is that they’re coming for? Or are more of them like, I know I want a side gig, I know I want to do something else and I don’t know what it is?

Sindy: I would say most people fall in the former category of either they know what the side gig is going to be or they already have one.

Lindsay: Okay.

Sindy: And either they want help starting it or they want help growing it. But I have had a number of people reach out who I helped them figure out what it was, either before or during my group coaching program. And I’ve also had a couple of people who have been through my program who have changed gigs mid Side Gig School. And that’s actually really fun to see. Like the tools that I teach translate kind of regardless of what the gig is.

So that’s been fun to see people come in and be like, I mean, one woman in my last round was like I’m coming in to grow a running coaching business, she’s like a marathoner. And she ended up leaving with her first client in a newly established medical practice consulting business. It’s like so different.

Lindsay: Yes. Okay, so that kind of leads into my next question, which is, is it like mostly this type of side gig or this, like these couple? Or is it truly like all over the board, doesn’t matter, you help with any of them?

Sindy: I would answer yes to both. So I haven’t yet met a side gigger, or a side hustler, or an idea I couldn’t help. And I would say I do see a lot of commonalities. So for sure, there are many different types of coaches.

There are people who are fitness wellness professionals that aren’t necessarily doing coaching, they’re doing more like training, or yoga retreats, or things in fitness wellness. Then there are consultants for businesses.

So I’ve worked with, you know, an engineer starting an engineering consulting business, a lawyer starting an HR consulting business, much like mine used to be, or not starting, growing. And I just mentioned this client who has the medical consulting. And then there are consultants for individuals, so someone who is helping families navigate like raising a child with autism or things like that.

So I would say those are the four main buckets. And then I’ve also had a sprinkling of people selling products. I would say mostly I work with, this is what’s drawn to me because this is what I’ve always done, service-based side hustles, and I get some product people too.

Lindsay: Okay, so kind of all over the board. If someone has a side gig they can come to you, you’re going to help them.

Sindy: Absolutely.

Lindsay: And is the goal, for most of them is it for it to not be a side gig or is it more of like embracing the side gig? Like I love this and I love my day job, and I want to do both.

Sindy: For most of them it is really keeping it a side gig. But I would say maybe there’s 25 to 30% who are like, “No, no, I want this to be the real gig.” And I think deciding what you want, but also being open to it evolving at different stages of life. Like I just in the last year became an empty nester, that’s a whole different beast. And then there are people with, you know, either young kids or teenage kids, you know, the whole parenting journey is so different.

Lindsay: Right.

Sindy: But I think people, like when they decide for themselves what they want it to be, at least for now, it’s really powerful. And I just help them get to where they want to be, not necessarily what I’ve done.

Lindsay: Yes, I remember when you very first applied, and we’ll talk about this in a minute, you’ve now been in two rounds of Coaching Masters. But I remember your very first application, I remember reading it thinking one, the name immediately I was like so clear what it is, I love this coaching program.

And I think I shared this with you about like I love how it is the Side Gig School. It’s not like turn your side gig into, because that’s what I see everywhere else kind of, is like take your site gig into like the full-time thing, like making all the money, doing all the things. And I think truly some people do want, and now I know for sure they do, because you’ve told me, but they love what they do full time and they love having a side gig.

And I just love that about your program, that it’s like truly embracing the kind of definition of the side gig.

Sindy: Yeah, I think that’s so fun. And then there’s another group that I didn’t necessarily think about when I first started the program, but you don’t need to have a nine to five. I have a lot of full-time moms I help.

Lindsay: I was thinking that as it was coming out of my mouth. I was thinking, like and then I thought and that’s also full time. Like in my mind, I tried that job, I wasn’t the best at it.

Sindy: Yes, me too.

Lindsay: And that is a full-time job. I’m pretty sure I tried that and just kept adding side gigs until it was like almost impossible for me to even be a stay-at-home mom anymore because I just didn’t have the time. And I like worked myself out of the position. But yeah.

Sindy: I fired myself pretty quickly.

Lindsay: Yeah, for sure. One day I told my husband, listen, this is just not, it turns out this just isn’t my thing. I’m going to have to figure something else out.

I do still love the flexibility, of course, as an entrepreneur of like being able to do things with my kids and be there for my kids when I am. And it’s not as much of a thing now because they’re older so they go to school and they’re gone all day and it’s great, and I work.

Sindy: Yeah, totally.

Lindsay: But yes, I did not mean to leave that out because I really, truly think that that’s one of the hardest full-time jobs around. So certainly not omitted on purpose.

So let’s kind of move into you’re currently in your second round of Coaching Masters. And I think sometimes people think like, well, why would I do it twice, right? Well, the first round is like I’m going to be a better coach. Isn’t that what it’s about? Like is that it?

So let’s talk about that. Why did you decide, and you’re not the only one, I’ve had other people on and we’ve talked about this a little bit. But what made you decide to apply for a second time?

Sindy: Yeah, so the impetus for the first round was, as you suggested, I just wanted to be a better coach. Like wait, there’s a program that’s just going to help me be a better coach? I’m kind of always wanting to be a student of whatever it is I’m engaged in. So that was the first round.

I found myself really, in the first round, focused almost exclusively on Side Gig School. And that has evolved and grown and I’ve refined it a lot. I started a podcast by the same name back in October, just called Side Gig School. And the second round I think my impetus was really, and I know I’ve used this phrase with you in our groups many times, I was feeling very bifurcated in my brain. Like I have two businesses, I’ve got my group coaching program and then I’ve got my one-on-one clients.

And because I focused so much in the first round on Side Gig School, I started to get a little confused in my mind about do they even relate? Am I running two different businesses? How could I integrate this in a way that feels better and more holistic to me?

And that was kind of like my whole impetus for round two was, okay, I need to understand, and obviously I’m the creator of it, but I need to understand my business a little better. Like zoom the camera lens out, bird’s eye view, who am I? What do I offer, not just in this one niche? And so that’s what I’m working on in round two.

And I feel like the second round has been amazing. Like I don’t compare, but I’m getting so much more out of the second round than I even did the first round and I’m sure it’s because it’s my second round.

Like the concepts, and I love this so much about your teaching, and obviously we see this in the podcast and also in the Coach Lab, which I’m also a member of because I have to do all the things you offer, is simplicity. Like you help make things simple. And when a coach is in a state of confusion, there’s nothing more important than getting help simplifying what’s happening in your brain.

So I think that’s been something that keeps drawing me to you and your programming and your teaching. And something that has really influenced not just the way I show up as a coach, but also how I show up as an entrepreneur.

Lindsay: Yeah, I love, I really love that. And, of course, I always am asking myself how can this be simple? Like really leaning into the idea of simplicity. And every time I simplify things for myself, things just get so much better, They run smoother, I feel calmer, like everything just, I think, is better when things are simple.

So if you’re listening and you’re curious about should I come into Coaching Masters, if you are dead set on having like 27 offers and a 52-step process and whatever, it’s maybe not your place. Now, if you have that and want to help simplifying it, of course, it’s your place.

Sindy: Exactly. And I remember from the last round, someone who’s been on your podcast I think maybe a couple of times, you know, Break Up Coach Dorothy, who’s just the best, in our first round really simplified her process to such a significant degree. And it was so fun to see her go through that process because it’s not like things weren’t working. Nothing was broken, she’s very successful and offers such great service to her clients, her brave hearts.

And it was so fun to see her embrace simplicity. And that’s something that I’ve just directly witnessed you help her with.

Lindsay: Yes, it’s one of my favorite things to do. And she still messages me every once in a while and says like, I can’t believe like— Just we chat, not all the time. But every once in a while she’s just like, “I can’t believe I didn’t see it.”

There’s something about just when you’re in it and thinking you really need all of those steps and that your clients want all of those steps, and they want you to prove to them how much you know and how many tools you have. And at the end of the day, they kind of don’t. If they can get results with less steps and less tools, that’s pretty powerful.

Sindy: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Lindsay: I think it makes the coach’s brain just clearer, calmer. Which really, I think, is one of the biggest changes I see in a lot of my clients, is that their brain is just so much calmer. And then I can just tell when I see them coach or when we coach on the calls that the coaching is just more clear and simpler and it just is kind of like a domino effect into everything.

Sindy: That has been very true for me. Like when I think about how I show up, whether I’m coaching in a group setting or my one-on-one clients, and I remember one of your, maybe it was a tagline or something in your marketing when I was first seeing your stuff was become the coach who can coach anyone on anything. And I thought that sounded so far-fetched. Like how could I coach someone on something I don’t personally know?

And now I really feel like I can coach anyone on anything because I have these really simple tools. And my brain is super focused and clean and clear when I’m coaching. And that’s such a tremendous benefit for the people I work with.

Lindsay: Yes. Yeah, I love that. And I still do say that. Now I, of course, add some caveats on like when they want to be coached and all the things. But yeah, I think that once you understand what actual coaching is and what really examining someone’s mind, how they’re thinking, how they’re feeling, it does become this like you don’t have to just know things about everything that they want coached on, because that’s kind of impossible, right?

Like if you tell yourself that that’s what coaching is, it’s kind of setting you up for some uncomfortable moments because there are always going to be times no matter, I don’t care who you coach or what your niche is, there are going to be times when clients come to you with things that you’ve never experienced. Even I’m sure you see that even in business in Side Gig School.

Sindy: I see it a lot in business, absolutely. I think my old belief set would have been something to the effect of I’m not the right coach for them or I can’t help. And now I don’t believe that at all. I really do know how to help.

Lindsay: Yes, so good. Okay, so one thing that I think could be interesting because I know I have a lot of listeners who kind of dabble maybe in coaching, or who want, they know they want to be a coach. They haven’t quite started, they’re like on that cusp. And I think one of the best ways to get started on something is to kind of think about it in the way that you teach it, right? Which is like you don’t have to quit your job today to be a coach, you can just start and make it a side gig.

I don’t even know specifically what I want to ask you. But let’s just like examine that a little bit. Like if someone came to you and they were like, okay, this is what I’m thinking, I know I want to be a coach. I know what it is. I’ve done my research, maybe I’ve worked with a coach. I know this is for me. What would you tell them? What are the first steps? How would they get started?

Sindy: Absolutely. I mean, first, and I love this question because first is simply deciding that you want to get started. So assuming that decision has already been made, it’s actually so easy. Like you literally name your business, which for most of us, it isn’t for me, but it is for you, is your name.

You decide who it is you want to help or what you want to help with. And if you’re a general life coach and you want to help all the people with all the things, great, that’s a decision too. You then tell people that you’re now offering coaching. It’s that simple.

So I work with a lot of people on like the “launch.” Like I’m launching my coaching business, what does that mean? It means you’re just telling people. It could be via text, via phone, you send out an email, you post on your social media outlets. Guess what, friends? I am now offering coaching. Here’s what I do, if you want to know more, let’s chat. Like that is a valid business launch. So simple.

Lindsay: Yes.

Sindy: And then there are a couple of little housekeeping items, I would say. I like to have people set up early on. You don’t need the website, you don’t even need like the legal structure, the LLC. You need to have, two things I think are necessary to begin.

A separate checking account or a way to track the money so you’re not, this is a little bit of lawyer speak, but commingling assets of personal and business. And you need to know what your offer is. That’s sort of it. So I work with people in four session increments for $800. I’m obviously just making that up out of thin air.

Lindsay: Right.

Sindy: So what’s the business? What’s the name? Track the money, have an offer, and then tell people. And that’s it. It’s so simple. And then, of course, all the stuff that gets in the way is the mind drama of am I ready? And maybe I don’t know enough, and all that sort of stuff. And so if that’s showing up for any of your listeners, I would say like bring it to a coach.

Lindsay: Hire you.

Sindy: Yeah, or hire me, better yet.

Lindsay: Yeah, I think that is such a good distinction, right? It’s like, we talked about this all the time in Coaching Masters in different ways. Not about this topic specifically, but it’s like, okay, there are the logistics, like you just figure it out. You make decisions, you implement them, and then there’s the drama that comes up, right? There are the thoughts, the doubts, the whatever that comes up.

And that’s where, and a coach can also help you with some of the strategy, of course. But that’s where the really like good coaching comes in, right? That is the part where it’s like, now what? Well, yeah, now maybe hire a coach, that might be the next step. Because that’s what we’re for, right?

Sindy: Exactly.

Lindsay: That’s what Sindy does.

Sindy: Yeah, that’s what I do. And it’s also funny, because if I look at my last business, forget the yoga, but the HR consulting. I did that, made it up, that was totally a DIY entrepreneurship kind of kit. And it was a mess. And it took a while and I didn’t know what I was doing. And, you know, eventually I figured it out.

But with my coaching business, since I became certified and became a coach, I’ve always had coaches. And that has made all the difference in the world to me and my business growth, and keeping my brain most of the time pretty simplified and happy and on track.

Lindsay: Yes. Yeah, it’s one of the things I’ve been thinking a lot about with the Coach Lab, right? Like people come into the Coach Lab, there’s a vault with lots of videos, with lots of teachings. But I think one of the most powerful things that you can do to learn how to coach or learn to be a better coach, or work on your skills is to watch coaching and be coached, right?

So kind of a similar thing, right? It’s like in order to grow a business, one of the best things you can do is, like in order to grow a coaching business, one of the best things you can do, I think, is be coached. Like understand what it’s like. See what you like as the client, what you don’t like. What structure do you like? What types of coaching do you like?

And it’s kind of like hands-on learning versus just reading more, watching more videos, you know, whatever that is. Like active consumption versus a little more like passive.

Sindy: Yep.

Lindsay: Okay, you said something that I want to talk about. I haven’t talked about this with anyone and I don’t even know if I’ve ever even told anyone that this happens. But I probably get more questions about this one thing that I’m going to tell you, than anything else. And I think it is the most random thing, maybe because I just never spent time thinking about it.

But it’s clearly a thing so many coaches, and probably all entrepreneurs think about, naming your business. And I’m curious because, so my business name is Lindsey Dotzlaf Coaching LLC. Yours is not your name, it’s Blue Tree, what is it?

Sindy: Blue Tree Coaching LLC.

Lindsay: Yeah. I’m positive, this probably comes up in your program, right? Like in the beginning, do people ask you?

Sindy: Yep.

Lindsay: What is your take on that? Is there a reason that you use something besides your name? And by the way, Sindy is previously a lawyer, but I feel like I need to add a disclaimer, like this is not actual legal advice. This is just Sindy’s opinion and my opinion.

Sindy: Thank you for that disclaimer.

Lindsay: Yeah, and maybe you can say it better than I do. But you know, this isn’t like legal advice. I’m just curious about it because so many people ask me.

Sindy: Yes, so I do think it depends on the industry we’re talking about. So I will have different answers for different side-giggers that I work with.

Lindsay: Okay.

Sindy: I think for coaches, really, the simplest thing you can do is pick your name. And if there’s a really fun reason why you want to pick another name, you can do that too. Which is why I picked blue tree, which I’ll explain in a sec.

But my HR consulting business, and you can also change the name, I think I had five different names over 18 years of my HR consulting business. I would just change the name. I think the last one was Sindy Warren and Associates, which was hilarious because I was a solopreneur.

Lindsay: You just left that door open just in case. Just in case anybody wanted to join you.

Sindy: The family joke was that it was my dog Woodrow, he was the associate. So when I wanted to start my coaching business it was, you know, Yogi brain of like, ooh, what do I want this to mean? And for me, I love tree imagery, I love the rootedness of literally the roots connecting to the earth and going deep. And I also love the expansion elements of the rising.

And the blue to me represents the expansiveness and unlimited possibilities of the sky. I know I may be sounding a little more woo than I usually do.

Lindsay: I love it. I love it.

Sindy: And that was really the impetus for Blue Tree Coaching. Like we’re going to get grounded and then we’re going to expand. That’s sort of how I view coaching. So that’s why I picked the name and it just spoke to me and I love my logo and some of the imagery I get to use.

But I don’t think it would have made a difference if my business name was Sindy Warren Coaching LLC. I really don’t think it matters. So if you have any drama about your name, like you don’t love your name, pick something you love. I think it really is that simple.

Lindsay: Yes, okay. I will give my answer so that maybe I can stop getting so many emails and messages about this. It is so funny how many people ask me, like they just are sure I am going to have the answer. Like I’m just going to solve it for them. And it’s just really interesting to me because I don’t think I put that much thought into it.

But the way I did pick was I don’t love naming things. And I knew how much drama I would have if I decided that it needed to be, like something you just said is like totally understand that. And also, never would my brain go to that place of like creating something that was so meaningful to me.

And I also knew, again, to bring it back to the simplicity of like this name will never, it can cover anything, right? So any service I ever add to my coaching can be added to like my business name is this, but I run the Coach Lab, right, and I have Coaching Masters.

And the only, I guess, maybe advice I would give, because this is the one time I’ve seen people kind of get into like a weird place with naming things, although your advice just now of like and you can change it would definitely solve this is when they pick something that’s very, like yours is very symbolic, right? Which could be used for anything. You could have anything under that, it’s very similar to using your name.

But sometimes people pick something that’s very pointed at like a certain maybe coaching method. It’s very related to the season of their business that they’re in in the moment. And then maybe two years later, as they’ve grown, as they’ve added things to their coaching repertoire, as they’ve just changed as a human, now all of a sudden it’s like, okay, I don’t really relate to this name anymore. And then they have drama about changing it and it’s a whole thing.

So that would be, I guess, my only advice on how to pick a name, but it is just interesting.

Sindy: That’s a great caveat, I like that one.

Lindsay: Yeah, I’m sure you probably see that sometimes where people pick a name. And do you ever think like, oh, maybe that might not be the best one?

Sindy: Yeah, totally. What I see people do, and I don’t see this with coaches as much as I do with other kind of side gigs, pick a name that’s very niche and then decide they want to change their niche and have all sorts of drama.

Lindsay: Oh yeah, that’s even a better way to say it, right? Which is like, yeah, very directed at a certain niche. And then maybe a year later you’re, narrowing or you’re changing altogether or whatever. And it’s just like one step that I didn’t want to ever have to think about, right? Like do I need to change my business name? That’s not for me, I don’t even like to pick program names, that takes me months.

So is there anything else that you would add to that?

Sindy: I don’t think so. I think that’s it. Like, again, how can it just be easy, your favorite question. And what makes me feel good? What sounds fun to me?

Lindsay: I love that. The other thing I would say is I knew my last name, like if you Google Dotzlaf, you’re going to find me. And some of my, like a few of my in-laws, like my husband’s family. But there are not many Dotzlafs. If you have a very common name, maybe that would be a reason also to think about picking something different, I don’t know. I don’t even know if it matters.

Sindy: That is actually a great point. Google the name you want to pick and see what comes up.

Lindsay: Yes. Yep, I remember when my very first coach, Stacey Boehman, her name was Stacey Smith. And the very first time I Googled her, I almost contacted a different coach because there was another coach with the name Stacey Smith and I just thought that was her. So yeah, that’s always something to consider.

But okay. I feel complete, is there anything else that you want to dive into out of what we just talked about?

Sindy: I don’t think so. I feel complete too.

Lindsay: I love this, this is going to so helpful for, especially for new coaches, all the stuff you just said about how to get started. It sounds so simple but this is going to blow people’s minds.

Sindy: Amazing.

Lindsay: I love it, I’m so grateful. Thank you for being here. Tell them all the places they can find you. If they want to find you, if they want to see what’s going on, if they want to follow you, where are your best places?

Sindy: Awesome. Well, first of all, I spell my name with an S, so that’s just a weird thing you should know if you’re looking for me, S-I-N-D-Y

Lindsay: Yes, and we will link this in the show notes. But yes, it’s Sindy with an S. all in the show notes. But yes, Sindy with an S.

Sindy: So you can find me on Instagram at BlueTree_Coaching. My website is bluetree-coaching.com. And my podcast is called Side Gig School. And if any of your listeners consider themselves side-giggers or side hustlers, they should reach out to me we can chat about you maybe being a guest on my podcast.

Lindsay: I love it.

Sindy: And the podcast is on all the platforms. Those are the places.

Lindsay: I love it so much. All right, well thank you so, so much for doing this. And, everybody, go find Sindy.

Sindy: Thanks, Lindsay.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Mastering Coaching Skills. If you want to learn more about my work, come visit me at lindsaydotzlafcoaching.com. That’s Lindsay with an A, D-O-T-Z-L-A-F.com. see you next week.