Lindsay Dotzlaf: Hey, this is Lindsay Dotzlaf, and you are listening to Mastering Coaching Skills, episode 295.

To really compete in the coaching industry, you have to be great at coaching. That’s why every week, I will be answering your questions, sharing my stories, and offering tips and advice so you can be the best at what you do. Let’s get to work.

Almost 300. What in the world? Welcome to today’s episode. I have the most exciting conversation for you. You are about to learn so much from my colleague, my client, my friend, Michelle MacNeil. She is a coach who teaches people systems and processes, which, of course, we all need a little bit of, including myself. And she is a genius. So, seriously, you are about to learn so much. I don’t even think I need to set it up any more than that. I just am going to say you have to listen. It’s going to help your business. Guaranteed.

Now, one side note, Michelle, as you will learn in this episode, does also have a farm. And in her office, as we were recording, were the cutest baby turkeys. And you can hear them chirping a teensy bit throughout the episode. So, if you hear that, I apologize, or not, because they’re adorable. And I really, really hope you enjoy this conversation.

One quick side note before we start the conversation, I am currently enrolling for the Reimagine Mastermind which begins in August of 2026. And the only way to join us is by invitation, and you get an invitation if you join the waitlist. The waitlist link will be in the show notes. And we are going to talk about the mastermind a little bit throughout this episode. So if it sounds intriguing, click the link, join the waitlist, and you will get all of the information. Now, let’s talk to Michelle.

Okay, hello, hello. I am so excited to have this conversation with you today, but let’s start with you telling everybody who you are and what you do.

Michelle MacNeil: Sure. Thank you so much for having me. I am Michelle MacNeil. I’m a certified systems business coach. So I work with small business owners who have hit what I call the systems wall, that point where the business is grown, but the way they’re running it hasn’t kept up. So they’re busy, they’re successful by most measures, and they’re holding it together with a collection of spreadsheets, sticky notes, and most likely coffee.

I run my business from a small hobby farm in rural Alberta, and honestly, the farm has pressure tested everything I’ve learned about building and implementing systems because on a farm things go wrong, a lot. Animals get out, equipment breaks, weather just happens and the farm doesn’t care about your plans. So you don’t build systems because everything is predictable, you build systems because it isn’t. And that’s what I help business owners do, build businesses that support your real life and not just the version where everything goes according to plan.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love that. And I have been coaching you for a while. You’ve been, you’re currently in Reimagine or Reimagine just finished up, but you’ve been in some of my other spaces and I always kind of had this like, okay, explain it again, what do you do? And then you said to me, you kind of explained it as, or you said like you say it as you’re too successful to quit, but too overwhelmed to enjoy it.

And immediately I was like, oh, yes. Okay, I get it. Absolutely. I think anyone that has kind of grown a business past a certain point, I don’t know exactly what that point would be, but a certain point knows exactly that feeling because there’s learning in the like, okay, it’s worked up till now and moving past this point is impossible the way I’m currently doing it. Is that right? Is that, would you say like that? And that’s what you help people with, right?

Michelle MacNeil: 100%. Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. Okay. And you, I’m just going to love on you for a second because I just love the way your brain works. You’re so good at just I can just tell from the way you talk about it. You’re just so good at seeing the problems, figuring out the solution, helping your clients with that. And you have worked in so many different capacities with your clients. As in like they have so many different types of businesses. Are there certain types of businesses that you work with specifically or just any business?

Michelle MacNeil: I love dabbling across industries because I always get to learn new things, but I really like working with trades businesses because they’re so moldable and there’s usually so many things that can be implemented so quickly to just launch them into like a really sustainable, successful phase of their business. Animal lovers just find me. I think they can smell the farm on me. And a lot of like just solo service providers because I think we just kind of band together when we find each other.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Absolutely. Yes. And I think a lot of us have a, a bit of a creative streak. So at least I know for me, anytime I find someone that’s really great at processes and systems, I’m like, ooh, I need to be near you. So I’m guessing you probably have that experience.

Michelle MacNeil: I do. I collect other nerds and just make them stay friends with me.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Amazing. What would, so for the listener, what is a trades business in case they don’t know what that means? Like what are some examples?

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah, I’ve worked with electricians, a premium roofer and gutter specialist. His business was pretty cool. Plumbers, anything in the blue collar service type industries.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Mhm. Love it. And you live in Canada. I think you work with the government maybe? Like through a service of the government?

Michelle MacNeil: Yes. I do some work with a organization called Community Futures. So it’s federally funded and they are offices in rural communities that support small business and entrepreneurs. And they run a program called Entrepreneurs with Disabilities. So I provide business coaching to small business owners that are either in the startup or they might be in like the full operational phase. I provide business coaching to them at no cost to them through programs offered through these offices.

And it’s really fun because startups have no money. So being able to help them through the beginning phases of business when nobody knows what they’re doing, it’s really nice to see because there’s not a lot of support for businesses at that stage.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love that. I remember the first time you told me that. And I know that’s not, those aren’t the only people you work with, but that is part of what you do in your business. And I remember the first time you told me that and I was like, that is amazing. I just love it. It’s so great. I love that they have that support and that they have you. I feel like you’re a genius and you probably completely change their lives.

Michelle MacNeil: It’s been really fun because now I’m teaching the business plan development cohort and so I just get to take a group of people through building business plans and business plans are one of my favorite things to do. So I’ve been told I make it exciting because business plans get a bad rap. They should be exciting and inspiring. That is my soapbox.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Well, and you’re funny and your personality is amazing. So they probably at least there’s that part where it’s like even if it’s something that they’re not loving, they have you and hopefully you at least make them like laugh sometimes.

Michelle MacNeil: I try and make the really dry parts funny.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love it. I love it. Okay. So let’s pause just a second there and just rewind for a minute. How did we get here? Like, how are you a coach?

Michelle MacNeil: How am I a coach? Oh, goodness. I’m an older mom because I just had a child later. So when I had a baby, all my friends either had older kids or were childless by choice. So I was super isolated when I was on mat leave because we’re in Canada, so we take time off. So I was super isolated and I lasted about four months and I was like, I need adults. So I took a couple just small freelance contracts and I was like, oh, this is fun. I’m packing a four-month-old to business meetings and around all the offices I was in and out of and it was super fun and I was like, you know what? I’m going to do this. So I decided to quit my job and not go back after mat leave. I made that decision January of 2020. So of course, March, I didn’t have a job if I wanted it.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Oh my gosh. Wow. Okay.

Michelle MacNeil: And so I was like, oh, cool. So I’m doing this. And so I was providing freelance services writing business plans for people that needed financing and it was great. It worked around a newborn schedule. I could do it whenever, wherever. And so I leaned into that for a bit. And then through the Community Futures offices I was working with, I got the opportunity to work with another federally funded program during COVID. It was called Project Gazelle and it was just support for female business owners.

So throughout the 3 and a half years of that program, I got to coach over 300 women on demand through the pivots and the shutdowns and the holy shits and the what do we do next? And then I was like, oh, look at that. They need much more than a business plan to get through this kind of stuff. And then at the very last in-person retreat for that program, I met the woman that teaches the system certification I took.

And you know those moments when things just like click into place? She started talking and I was like, this is it. This is exactly what I need. And I gently accosted her at the break and told her I needed to take her training and her name is Beverly and she’s amazing. And so I took the training as fast as I could and I have not looked back since.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Amazing. That is wild that it was January of 2020. I just my brain is still stuck in that part because that is, was that good or bad? Were you like, ah, if I’d waited a couple more months, I could have just been doing this and still had a job?

Michelle MacNeil: I really didn’t want to go back to the job. I really, really didn’t. And so it was just kind of like, huh. And I was lucky that we were in a position that I had a cushion to figure it out because I was on maternity leave so I was getting our unemployment and then because of COVID, they extended it. So I got an extra few months of paychecks before I was like, okay, now it’s sink or swim. So I had some time to be like, okay, what does this look like? And so we dealt with that and then exactly one year later, we moved to the farm just to make things harder.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Because why not? Everything’s going so great.

Michelle MacNeil: Exactly.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Let’s talk about that for a second. How did you get there? Like, what was that decision? Why did you make it? Why in the world would you want to have a farm is my question?

Michelle MacNeil: Because it’s glorious out here. Okay, so again, COVID made us do it. We were in the process of selling our house when COVID hit. And so our house sale fell apart on conditions, long story, but it fell apart. So COVID hit, we were in lockdown in a fully packed house that we were expecting to leave in two weeks. And we’re like, okay. So, of course, we sat tight. What do you do at that point? It took us an entire year from that point to sell our house. And at that point it was peak COVID. So places are flying off the literal realtor shelves. I don’t know.

So we were calling our realtor, places were getting offers before we could even get into see them and we’re like, we ended up between homes, we have family, we were not out on the streets, but between homes for almost 12 weeks with a 2-year-old and two small puppies. Do not recommend. And so we, while couch surfing and we had a lake spot so we’re bouncing between all these places, we expanded our search radius, found this little spot. I remember driving up here and the big trees, like as we were driving up the driveway, we’re just like, oh shit, here we are.

And we knew it as we were driving up. But we always knew we wanted a little slice of our own. COVID being locked in with like neighbors on top of you was like the breaking point. We’re like, we need out of here. And so we found here, we’ve got 20 acres. We do have neighbors, but they’re not super close and they’re way more awesome than the neighbors we had in town. And yeah, when it comes to what made us do it, I, the blind confidence we had not knowing what we now know, but at the same time, it’s been amazing. And no one who knows me is surprised that I found a way to collect animals in my adulthood.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. Yeah, I mean, when you told me this, I was like, yeah, this all makes sense. Now, I only know you after this decision, but it seems like it tracks to me. I am wondering, so it wasn’t like we’re looking for a farm.

Michelle MacNeil: We started looking at like just acreages or like raw land. Lindsay Dotzlaf: You just needed a little space.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah, just somewhere our neighbors couldn’t look down into our backyard. That’s all we wanted.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. And then did you, what kind of farm is it? Because is it like, you know, do you plant things? Is it just animals? Is it…

Michelle MacNeil: It’s a little hobby farm. It’s more humbling than hobby. We’re in the middle of real farmland so you can see the real farmers doing like crop stuff and we’ve got a dairy farm up the road and a beef farm across the road. And for us, it’s just whatever we’re having fun with. So we have our dogs because they were pets before we moved here. We have a collection of barn cats because that’s what you do.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah.

Michelle MacNeil: We’ve got chickens. We have turkeys.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Whether you like it or not, I think they just come.

Michelle MacNeil: Yes. You need them.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: They just show up.

Michelle MacNeil: Actually, yes. Two of our three just randomly showed up.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: But they get all the mice. I know this from the, the horse barn. You must, you have a barn, you must have cats.

Michelle MacNeil: You, you have to. Yeah. And so we’ve got chickens and then in the summer we do turkeys. We just got two new lambs because we need more mowing power. So there’s a whole lot of cute going on right now.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: This just means like they eat the grass.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. They’re not like pulling, show you have much I know about this stuff. Like they’re not pulling like a little little tiny sheep tractor or something.

Michelle MacNeil: No. That would be adorable. You can tell why this was sectioned off of real farmland. Like it’s a cute little corner. We’ve got trees, we’ve got hills, we’ve got a little creek. It’s not farmable, which also means parts of it are not mowable. So we need more nimble mowers. So for us, that means we get to have sheep.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love that. Okay. So mostly animals.

Michelle MacNeil: I’ve got a garden too.But that’s just, it’s that’s for us.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. Like a big backyard garden maybe.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Not like a plant the crops and then have tractors and all of that.

Michelle MacNeil: No, just a big backyard garden full of stuff we actually eat.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Do you have tractors?

Michelle MacNeil: We have a tractor.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Like if you have a tractor, it’s officially a farm.

Michelle MacNeil: I agree. But what’s really funny is seeing our tractor beside like the tractors. Our tractor looks like the ones that get eaten for breakfast. It looks like a toy.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Some of the fields we drive by where we live on the way to like the horse barns, there are tractors that are like wider than the road. I don’t know what they’re called, but the wheels will go on each side of the road and I’m always like, what…

Michelle MacNeil: You can like drive right underneath it if you wanted.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes, and I’m like, what am I supposed to do here? Like I just the first time I saw it happening, I was like…

Michelle MacNeil: Those are usually sprayers.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Yes. Wild. Okay. Well, now we see the setup. So you have a business, you’re teaching other people how to run businesses. You’re also running a small farm at the same time. And because of that, you have to master your time skills. I’m certain of that. And I know it because we’ve we’ve talked about it, we’ve coached on it, and I’m like endlessly impressed by how much you get done always. So it makes so much sense that you teach systems and processes. Is that something that has always come like naturally to you or is that was it like you learned it out of necessity and now you teach it or both?

Michelle MacNeil: A little bit of both. I’ve always been a planner, shout out anxious 80s kids. I’ve always been a planner because it keeps the anxiety in check. And so yeah, that the planning part comes naturally. Once I took the systems training, it happened at a time that I was very burnt out with the farm because we moved out here knowing nothing.

And so we did all the things that we could possibly do as fast as we could possibly do them, which was so fun for like six months and then it was the, uh oh, what have we done? And then the two years from that point was just hard because then it was trying to get caught up with it, figuring out the things we don’t know, constantly in reactive mode because again, we were doing things faster than we should have with all these variables that are unknown to us. And so I took my systems training right in the height of when it was like the hardest.

And I started to see like, oh, I think this could work over here. What if this was a system? And so then I started pulling them into the parts of the farm that were killing me, just killing me. And all of a sudden those little pieces got easier and I was like, oh, this could work outside of business. And then when I find something that I tend to get drunk with power, and so I just went ham on planning things around the farm and building the systems around it.

And it was still super bumpy, but we are five weeks away from five years on the farm. And I am happy to say I’m very proud of our systems and the amount of things we get done on a regular basis. Even though our to-do list consistently gets longer. I think that’s just something we have to accept out here. But things are being done, we feel more on top of it, and I’m not a crazy person every day anymore. All great things.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: And does your partner, does he participate in this? Does he just like let you handle it? Is he an organized systems person or is he like, you’ve got this, I’ll just do whatever you say?

Michelle MacNeil: He’s not an organized systems person, but he’s totally a doer. So once it’s mapped out, he’s just a doer. And the, the part I found is he’s a great systems tester because I just get in my routine and then I’ll tolerate something longer than I should. I went away for a weekend, so he did my area of chores. It’s just because it’s easier to split it up.

And so he did my chores for three days. When I came back, the gate that was pissing me off was fixed. He moved the latch on the inner barn door that I kept hitting my head on because I kept complaining about it. Like just the little things that I wasn’t going to slow down and do, he went and polished a bunch of stuff for me. So my systems in the morning run faster.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: That’s nice.

Michelle MacNeil: It really is. So now, once I realized that, now every so often, we trade stuff to see where we can do that.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: That’s smart. Wow. I like that. Okay.

Michelle MacNeil: And then that way also trading it, I know the parts, I’m more familiar with the parts he takes care of. So again, the system, I’m not missing anything when I go do it when he’s away at work.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay, maybe you won’t have an answer for this. I maybe there isn’t one, I’m not sure, but in, so for, you know, it’s mostly coaches listening to this, is there some form of that that can happen? Like obviously I’m not going to have my husband come in and like run my business. I don’t think, unless you’re going to tell me I should, but is there like a, like that feels so sexy to me. I’m like, oh, yes, that is great. How do I get that?

Michelle MacNeil: Don’t get your husband to come around your business. They’ll never do it the way you want them to. But yeah, you can totally do this with other business owners or other coaches. Like I know I’ve got like a co-working crew. If I needed someone to go through something and be like, is this working, they could do that for me. One of them was my tester. It’s like, I’m doing something on Paperbell for the first time. I need you to register and tell me what it looks like and tell me how to make it better and tell me if it’s ugly. And they did and they reported back everything was good and it’s like, okay, perfect.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: This is so good. Everybody needs to just like pause and take this in. Find a coach bestie, trade links, say, does it work? Do you like the way it looks? Does it make sense? Does it, whatever the questions are that you need answered? I think that’s genius.

Michelle MacNeil: Totally. And if you don’t have business friends on your speed dial, email list, whatever, find some.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: It is one of my favorite things about running a mastermind is that, is like watching people connect, but also knowing at least for me, like how, and I’ve talked about it so many times on the podcast, like how important that has been for my business the whole time, all around.

Michelle MacNeil: 100%.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I’ve never done this thing though, and I might be, like this I need to like make a short list of people that I’m like, who would I want to trade with? Whose feedback would I want? Because I do it myself, right? I’ll send, I’ll like use a, I have a dummy email account or there’s a way you can do it, put like test in the email. I always forget that way. But it’s different when you’re testing it yourself because you know what to expect and know whatever. So it’s like you might miss things that are supposed to be there that aren’t or the other way around or whatever.

Michelle MacNeil: You’re too close to it. It’s always good to have that fresh set of eyes and especially from a disconnected third party.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Yeah. Someone who hasn’t spent the entire day working on it that is like, yes, that just worked. That’s fine. That’s all I needed.

Michelle MacNeil: Yes. Exactly.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Just looking at it with a little more like, oh, this is delightful. Or, oh, this took a long time to figure out or whatever. Okay, amazing. So, let me see. I took, so when I asked you before we started, I was like, what are the biggest things that you solve? Like what are the biggest problems that you help your clients solve? Time was the number one thing. So, let’s dig into that maybe a little more. Is there anything else you want to, I mean, we briefly touched on it, but what else specifically about time, thinking about coaches listening, what would you say like, here’s something you need to know?

Michelle MacNeil: You decide where your time goes. And if you have no time, that is a decision you’ve made. It may not be conscious, it may not be malicious, it might not be intentional, but that’s a decision you’ve made. And it doesn’t mean it’s easy, but taking control of what gets your time will change your entire experience.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: This is going to sound familiar because I just interviewed Binie. I’m pretty sure her episode is coming out the week before this and we did talk about time because she has the planner and everything. You know that because she’s in Reimagine. But they’re going to be like, okay, I get it. But it’s so true and let’s just both say that does not mean that you need to beat yourself up or shame yourself for it or any of the things. It just is, yeah, if you’re the one who created it, the good news is you’re also the one who can fix it.

Michelle MacNeil: Exactly. And it’s just data. If you’re using it to be mean to yourself, well then we have another pep talk to have. It’s just data to be used to help you make better decisions.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. One thing you said before we started that I just love so much is feelings are, feelings are terrible at business math. And I feel like this is one of the places where that applies. Like feelings are in this case are really terrible at like solving time problems for you.

Michelle MacNeil: Yes. Yes. We tend to make decisions based on either guilt or fear or shame or excitement if something’s like shiny and new. But if you don’t have a plan behind it, it’s, you’re just setting yourself up to be more mean to yourself about it. It’s, you’re allowed to have your feelings. Like I have a 7-year-old. We have big feelings. I’m still learning my big feelings.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Mhmm.

Michelle MacNeil: We need them, but they shouldn’t be making your business decisions. That’s why we have data and that’s why we have plans that have metrics to check. If you’re making the decisions out of the feelings, they’re going to be terrible and they’re going to feel terrible.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Definitely that. Yes. It never makes the situation better from what I’ve experienced. It always takes it in the wrong direction first.

Michelle MacNeil: Yes.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: And now we have a bigger problem to solve.

Michelle MacNeil: And more feelings.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Totally. Yes. Now they’re just like really amped up. Sometimes, I mean, this is just like full disclosure, right? This is full transparency. Sometimes it’s like, I know I’m doing it and I can’t stop. And I’m like, this is only making it worse. Lindsay, you are literally making it worse right now. And I’m to myself, I’m like, yep, here we go. Let’s go. Let’s go all in on making it worse. That’s going to be really great.

Okay, so for the people listening, if they, when I said the, the part about like too successful to quit, but too overwhelmed to enjoy it. If they resonate with that, if they’re like in any form sitting in that place where they’re like, oh my gosh, yes. Like I didn’t know maybe like I didn’t know it was going to be like this. I love coaching, but I can’t like get it together. I’m always overwhelmed. Give them one thing. Like, where’s the first, I don’t know exactly what question to ask. What’s the right question? Is it like, where’s the first place they should look? Is it, what’s the first step towards becoming less overwhelmed?

Michelle MacNeil: My first step is always doing a brain dump to just see what’s rattling around up there because it gets really loud when they’re all just like bouncing off each other and then getting it on paper, whether it’s terrifying on paper or not, at least it’s out and it’s tamed.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: And what are we getting out? Thoughts or…

Michelle MacNeil: All of it.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: To-do list, everything?

Michelle MacNeil: Yes. Sometimes my brain dumps have like multiple columns. It’s like the things I need to get done. But then once that’s done, like my main thing with clients is what’s sucking the life out of you right now? Because we all have something in our business that’s doing it, whether it’s just it could be a simple admin process that just takes twice as long as it should and we just tolerate it because I, same reason I tolerated my broken gate just because it’s easier to just spend the extra 30 seconds fiddling with it every day than actually taking the five minutes to have my husband come and fix it.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: He he probably had it, he dealt with it one time and he was like, that is enough. I can’t. Or he just loves you so much he was like she shouldn’t have to deal with this every day.

Michelle MacNeil: I think it’s both. I think it’s both like, why the hell hasn’t she fixed this already? And if I have to do this for three more days, I’m just going to fix it now. And I love him for being a doer because I’m a starter, he’s a finisher.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: That’s a great combo. My husband and I are both starters. So sometimes I’m like, well who’s going to who’s going to like finish the things? I think our 16-year-old sometimes is like, hey guys, when are we going to, she’s like the finisher. I think I’m like, ooh, that’s probably not good. I’ll take on some of that. Thank you. I’ve actually gotten much, much better at it. It used to be really bad before, before coaching really before like I’ve learned, oh, to put probably some processes in place to deal with it. Okay, so they’re going to identify what is sucking the life out of them. And then what are they going to do about that thing once they’ve identified it?

Michelle MacNeil: We’re going to solve it with systems. We’re going to find out why it’s sucking the life out of them, if it’s something they need to do. If they have the ability to delegate or outsource, we can look at what that looks like. If they don’t, if they’re solo, how do we make this so easy, it’s not like every time you have to do it. What makes this easy? What would it look like if it were easy? And how do we make it so easy it gets done? Because again, you can build all the systems you want, if you’re not going to use them, they’re useless.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Okay. And one thing, another thing we talked about before we hit record was how sometimes we see people including myself, including like my business where the processes and systems can become too complicated. They kind of we overcorrect a little bit. What does that do you see that with your clients and how do you solve for that? How would they know? Like if someone’s listening and they’re like, I wonder, what would be the tell that like that’s maybe a thing happening?

Michelle MacNeil: So, I worked with a client a while back. If you hear this, I love you. She came to me, again, super successful, but completely overwhelmed. And on our very first session, we do 90 minutes, it’s a deep dive, we do all the planning for what we want to get done together. And she was telling me about this, her Asana setup. She had client projects and she had things over here and all this stuff and it was gorgeous and it was color coded. And she’s showing me all of this and I am like drooling because it’s beautiful. And I was like, this is incredible. I was like, how long have you been using it? And she stopped and she’s like, oh, I haven’t used it. I just built it.

And I was like, okay, why haven’t you used it? She’s like, well, and then she starts listing all the steps that go into using it and populating it and doing it day after day and in between clients and and then she started laughing and she’s like, I’m, it’s not sustainable. And I was like, no, no, it’s not. And she was so, being so hard on herself for not using it. And then it just came to the point where, yeah, it’s beautiful. It’s got all this stuff. There’s so much to grow into, but you can’t grow into predetermined spaces. We don’t know how we’re going to grow. We don’t know how much we’re going to grow. We don’t know what direction we’re going to grow. So building it all out was absolutely not helpful. So what we did, we scrapped it. We started on paper.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Oh, it was so painful for her. It had to have been. Michelle MacNeil: It, yeah, it was.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I bet you had to like pry it out of her hands I’m positive of that.

Michelle MacNeil: It was beautiful. It was hard. And then we just mapped it on paper. What does the process look like with the little offshoots of, okay, but what does if this, then what? If this, then what? Mapped it on paper, took it back to Asana, still color coded, a fraction of what it was before, and at the end of our six months together, consistently using it and starting to add in little pieces of other functionality that made sense for where she was.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: So good.

Michelle MacNeil: And now she uses her Asana religiously and it is very powerful for her. And it still has none of the extra, well, a fraction of the extra crap she had at the beginning. And now it’s usable and functional and she’s happy and not crazy.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: This is my pet peeve when I’m working with coaches that are some form of exactly what you just said where I’m like, okay, but it sounds like your business has become running the, that system instead of running your business. That has become your job and I know you feel so productive when you’re doing it. And that is especially helpful when you don’t have as many clients as you want or when you don’t have as much…

Michelle MacNeil: That is busy, not productive.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. And I’m always like, no, no. I have learned the hard way over and over and over that anything more complicated than my notes app takes me out. Just I have such a good system. Now, I’m sure I could create something very simple in something like Asana or whatever. But when I have had, you know, when people have worked for me and they have set it up and because they’re kind of like in a business manager role, let’s be very clear, they did nothing wrong. Lovely.

Nothing has gone wrong here except that it just does not work for me. My brain is like, this whatever is going on here with all the tabs and all the things and all the whatever, my brain is like, no, abort mission, like get out of here. I can’t even look at it. Like gives me I get like hives. And so I’m always like, okay, well, here’s what I’m going to do. And then I’ll just give you this. And if you want to use that, you can put it in there.

So for people like me on the other end of the spectrum that would never create something too complicated, what’s the like first step maybe towards like how would I clean it? Like if you saw my notes, you’d probably be like, ooh, okay, there’s probably like one step past this that would be, that would work well for you.

Michelle MacNeil: And that would just be digging into your preferences on it. If you like the notes app, cool. Where’s the organization? What’s the system behind organizing it? How do you know you’re going to be able to find that note again when you need that note? And it could be as simple as, I don’t know how notes work if they’re like searchable.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: You can use like hashtags now.

Michelle MacNeil: There you go. It could be as simple as you have all your notes and just based on what’s in them, you have like three or four different hashtags. So it’s all under what would it look like if it were easy? What’s the easiest way to track these? And that’s, I believe that was Tim Ferris, what would it look like if it were easy? That’s my starting point with everything because I don’t have time or brain power to complicate everything.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Mhmm. Yes, that’s one of my favorite questions. It’s so great. Okay, so I think I’m doing it right so far. And then, so it’s basically like when I come up against a problem, then I solve for it. But right now, it’s just working.

Michelle MacNeil: Completely. Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Some people are literally shaking right now. Like, did Lindsay just say she runs her business in her notes app?

Michelle MacNeil: I run my business out of Google Docs. Once Google Docs added tabs, game over for me. I, everything is a Google Doc. And I love it.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Okay, I’ve actually gotten very good at Google Docs as well. I just run the organization happens in the notes app and then the like anything I need to find is all in Google Docs and it seems to work very well for me. So…

Michelle MacNeil: I don’t see how your notes app is any different than me and my messy notebook. It’s where all my organization goes, it’s where all my thoughts go. And then it gets organized into like my digital calendar or into the Google Doc where I need it. There’s nothing wrong with that.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes.

Michelle MacNeil: Does your system work for you, Lindsay?

Lindsay Dotzlaf: It does, so far. And I will say the messy notebook is the thing I did outgrow at one point. It was like this, it cannot be like this anymore. There’s no way. Like no way is my business making it past this point with this system because it was just, you know, like flipping back and forth and where is this thing and where did I write this thing? And it really took me a minute. This was years ago, but it took me a minute to be like, nope, I think it’s time to be fully digital.

Michelle MacNeil: I’m bumping up against that right now. I just love my notebooks. I giving up my paper planner was the hardest thing I ever did. But I don’t have time to maintain a paper planner. It has to be digital, it has to be on the go, it has to be on my phone for when my life is going sideways. But yeah, I’m bumping up against that. I’m just I’m holding on so tight because I just love my stationery supplies. So if I give up my notebook, I have no reason to go buy notebooks. What am I going to do?

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I know. But listen, it got to the point where I, like now I’m just like fully digital and I resisted it for so long, especially the planner because I also love buying the planner. I’m like picking the cover. Oh my gosh, it’s so fun. What’s my personality this year? How do I even know that now without a planner? I don’t know. But it got to the point where I was like had multiple rubber bands around it. Like it was like holding on by a thread by the end of it and it hadn’t even been like six months, I think. And I was like, yeah, I think…

Michelle MacNeil: And I like it being color coordinated and pretty and then my life is not pretty. So then they get crossed out with arrows and it looks like a crime scene. And my beautiful planner is now just stressing me out because it’s not beautiful anymore.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes, yes. Oh my gosh. Or I would be gone from home for whatever. Like, you know, running an errand or, on vacation, I’m pretty good about not working on vacation, but I don’t know, traveling for some reason and I would need it and I wouldn’t have the information I needed and it would be an emergency and oh, yeah. I remember those days.

Michelle MacNeil: After the second client meeting mix up, that was when I was like, okay, I have now screwed up twice with clients of it being my fault. This cannot happen again. That was the end of my paper planner experience.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: That is such a good point. So for anybody listening who is in this phase, because I know there’s still some people left that’s holding on tight to planners, that is the, I think that’s it. It’s like when you start to have mistakes, especially if they affect your clients or if they just affect your time in a really, you know, big way, it might be time to be like honest about it with yourself.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. Let’s see. One thing you said before we started, before we hopped on, business problems aren’t motivation problems. Let’s talk about that. What do you mean by that?

Michelle MacNeil: So most business owners don’t have a motivation problem.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: But they really think they do, a lot of them.

Michelle MacNeil: They do. If I just had more discipline, if I was just better at this, if I could just…

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Be more consistent.

Michelle MacNeil: Right? It’s not a motivation problem. It’s usually a systems and infrastructure problem. Of course, it’s going to feel hard if you’re trying to remember everything that has to go on. Having a few simple systems just removes that. And when you remove those pieces from your brain, all of a sudden you have more power in your brain to do the important things and move the needle on the things that need to be moved. Because, yeah, it’s not that they’re not working. They’re working. They’re working their asses off.

It’s just that they’re working on reacting to things that are happening or fully focused on the minutia of the business. The actual business doesn’t move anywhere. The business operates day-to-day. But the business doesn’t move anywhere. And then that comes into the working in your business, working on your business. Sometimes you have to work in your business. Sometimes you just have to. That’s part of it. But if you never have that time or protect that time to work on your business, you’re going to feel like you have a motivation problem. But that’s not what the problem actually is.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. I am just having this visual as you’re talking where it I think it’s like if anyone is listening and they feel like they are just running as fast as they can on a treadmill and couldn’t possibly pause or like step off for a second because then everything will come crashing down. I think it’s that’s probably a sign we need some systems and processes.

Michelle MacNeil: If you stop moving for a second and everything’s going to come falling down, you have a systems problem. But the good news is, systems problems are solvable.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Systems aren’t software. What does that mean?

Michelle MacNeil: From my vantage point, a system is simply the way something happens within your business. Sometimes that is software, absolutely. But a system is simply the way something happens within your business, which means you have systems whether you know it or not. Basically, the way you’re currently doing something is your system. Even if you do it differently every time, that is your system. Even if it’s done by whoever gets there that day, however they feel like doing it, that is your system.

And so if you are liking the results you’re getting out of these systems, fantastic. Document it, see if there’s anywhere to make it better, move on. If you’re not getting what you want out of these systems, document it, see what’s missing, fix it and move on. Like it’s again, it can be so simple when we don’t make it so big.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: This, I feel like word for word, I probably have a podcast that says exactly that. I’m cracking up as you’re saying this because I’m thinking about what I say to coaches who are like, I don’t have a coaching process. And I’m like, if you’re coaching clients, you absolutely have a coaching process. Of course you do. It’s whatever you’re doing now is your process. Is it working? Is it not working? Right? It’s like that’s the only, do you need a process? You already have one. Do you need a new process? I don’t know, it just depends. Is it working or not?

If it’s not working, then yes, we need to figure out maybe not an entirely new process, which maybe we can speak to that because you said like, don’t throw everything out. And I would say the same for coaching, right? Like for when you think about coaching skills and how you interact with a client, like don’t throw everything out. Let’s look at like what isn’t working and just fix those pieces.

Michelle MacNeil: I say it’s evolution, not revolution. And this is also something I learned on the farm. If you change too many variables, you have no idea what the hell went wrong. But if you change one variable at a time, you can see its effect, you can see if you want to go further down that route or there’s a different route. One variable at a time will give you so much data and your next decision will be that much better and the next decision will be that much better because the data compounds and it helps you make these decisions.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes. Yes. Oh my gosh, it’s like when coaches have an offer that they love, but it’s just like they’ve been trying to sell it for a long time and it’s just not working. And they love the offer. This is a little different maybe if it’s like this is just really not the offer. But sometimes what they’ll do is they’ll just then they’ll like change the offer, the price, who they’re talking to and next thing you know, I’m like, oh, you’re running a totally different business now. Like you’ve literally just started a new business today.

And it sounds kind of a like a similar thing. It’s like now we’re just starting from zero. Well, not zero, but we’re starting from just a lower on the scale from 1 to 10 of like the what you’re bringing to the situation, like the expertise that you already had built from whatever it was that you were doing previously. The same for systems. Okay, what is the difference? And maybe there’s not one, and maybe this is a really stupid question, but it’s okay, I’m just going to stick my neck out there and just like look stupid for a second. What’s the difference between a system and a process?

Michelle MacNeil: I think they’re the same thing.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay.

Michelle MacNeil: A system is a documented process.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Maybe like a process could be a little like accidental and a system is more maybe a little more like, oh, here’s how I do it. Like you’ve documented it.

Michelle MacNeil: It could be. But yeah, in my mind, a system is just a documented process. And so, and I probably use those two interchangeable as I talk about things.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I think I do. That’s why I was like, I wonder if I’m like saying these things wrong.

Michelle MacNeil: I don’t think so. The only person that’s going to call you on is a systems nerd and I don’t think I’m going to call you on it. So…

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Probably if my if we got my husband in here, I bet he would be like, listen, I’ll tell you because…

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah, well, we’re not asking his opinion right now.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes.Well, because I’m sure in his like computer world, there’s probably like a technical difference between like a…

Michelle MacNeil: Oh, totally.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Like a tech difference between a system and a process. Okay. Well, I mean, I feel like we’ve covered so much ground. I’m just looking at my notes. What did I what haven’t I what haven’t we talked about? Michelle MacNeil: I think we’ve hit all the important things. I’m looking at my notes too. Look at us go.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I know. I think, okay, so what I would like to do is ask you just some like general business questions that you can answer about your coaching business or about the farm or both. Okay. And I really would love some farm answers because as you know, I’m obsessed with your farm. So, I can’t wait to visit it someday for sure. I’m just going to show up at some point.

Michelle MacNeil: We have a cabin.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: You do?

Michelle MacNeil: We have a cabin.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: What? Is this like a camping situation or like a…

Michelle MacNeil: No, it’s actually it’s attached to our shop. So we have a shop, it’s got like this weird underground tunnel thing, like we have so much space over there. But then there’s a bathroom and a cabin that overlooks the rolling hills. It’s gorgeous. My kid and I have winter sleepovers over there.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Is it heated?

Michelle MacNeil: It has power. We can heat it.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. I mean, it doesn’t have to be.

Michelle MacNeil: Oh, yes, it does. We’re in Canada.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. Well, yes. I mean, I was just saying, I wasn’t like it’s a deal breaker if it’s not. I thought you might say like, oh, it has like a, a stove.

Michelle MacNeil: It’s not that big. It’s really just like a bedroom and a bathroom. But no, it’s connected to the shop so it’s got power, it’s got running water. It’s just a bedroom that we call a cabin over there.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay, but now I need to know about an underground tunnel.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah. So our shop is a big ass shop and then there’s like a ramp that goes down to this cement room. The people before us, she bred and groomed dogs. That was like their dog grooming room and then there’s a little little office type thing attached to it. And then it goes into the bathroom and then into the cabin and then out the front cabin door is part of the cow pasture.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. Okay. This is fascinating. I love this. Okay so, all right. Back to you distracted me with the underground tunnel. I’m like, wait a minute. Let me just come back. What was my question? Okay, what here’s my first question. What is the hardest part, hardest part or hardest experience in running your business that you’ve had since you started?

Michelle MacNeil: Accepting that I’m the problem in most things.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Both on the farm and in your coaching business?

Michelle MacNeil: 100%. And it’s funny because like with accountability with friends and like masterminds, it’s like, well, what are your obstacles? Me, every time the obstacle is me because you can’t have business development without personal development. And I tried really, really hard to just focus on business development. No, I’m going to be good at business. I’ll get to me later. I’m fine.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah.

Michelle MacNeil: I’m not fine. And the farm too, it was you really lose your perfectionism and my mom once asked me like, how do you do it all? And it’s you have no choice. You have to figure it out. And sometimes that is the hard part, is you have to figure it out because there’s no other choice. There’s no just not dealing with it because those are lives. But taking that learning and bringing it into business, like I have to figure it out. This is your life. And taking the lessons that the farm teaches you whether you’re ready for them or not and then moving those into business has been the biggest part of my business growth.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. And how have you learned, and I wonder if the farm maybe has helped with this or maybe not, maybe it’s steered you in the in the other direction. I’m curious, I guess. I feel like just my work with you, it feels like one of the things that has had to kind of happen for you is you’ve had to, on occasion, slow down a little and like feel the feelings. Michelle MacNeil: God, I hate that.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. Yeah. I was just thinking as you were talking, there’s such a difference in you now from when, and I don’t even know how long ago that was. Couple of years maybe? I don’t know. Do you know how long you’ve been in in my world? Like how long have I been coaching you?

Michelle MacNeil: I want to say I joined The Coach Lab December of 2023. No, it might be earlier than that because I’ve been in R-imagine for eight months and then before that, I did Coach Project and then before that, I did no Biz Pods and then Coach Project. So it might be 2022.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay. So, yeah, it just feels like that you’re like a a different human. I mean, you were amazing then and you’re amazing now, but you’re like way more chill.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah. Yeah, I am. And that’s also wonderful. As someone who was an anxious kid and grew up with a lot of anxiety, getting to this stage of my adulthood and getting feeling like I have my life together for the most part has changed a lot of that. I am a completely different person.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah.

Michelle MacNeil: But Reimagine was a big part of that this past year too. Reimagine really kind of launched that part of it that I was avoiding so much.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yeah. I think maybe that’s why I see it. I feel like I maybe I recognize part of myself in that because I was also quite anxious. I’m very open about that. I used to have all kinds of panic attacks and whatever all the time. And people that know me now are often like, you’re just like so calm. First of all, I’m not just like always so calm, but I do come off as fairly chill, I guess would be the word that a lot of people would use.

And it’s because, it’s not because I don’t feel feelings anymore, it’s quite the opposite. It’s like I had to actually learn, like I think the anxiety was like I was never feeling the feelings so they were just like pent up to here, like literally coming out of my shooting out of my eyeballs. And now, now I just feel all the feelings all the time. And so I think it’s just like lowered that threshold of whatever’s built up. I feel like I can see that in you.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah, learning to sit in my feelings. Oh, man. And again, I can thank you for this. I remember there was maybe it was Coach Unfiltered when you had to sit with something and you just like let us see you process it. And I was like, oh, for fuck’s sakes, I got to feel my feelings now. And then I did and yes, and then they still come out my eyeballs first, but I find now that I’m allowing myself to feel them, it’s quick and dirty and then it’s like, okay, I’ve had my 5-minute cry. I’m better. Let’s what’s next? But yeah, getting to that point was huge. I tried not to have feelings for a very, very long time.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I think I’m pretty good at, I’m just kind of putting this together in this moment. I think I’m pretty good at working with people like that because I can just I can recognize it because it was me. And it’s finding that sweet spot between like you have to feel all the things and also you can’t just park there and live there forever. And if you’re truly feeling the things, I don’t actually think your body can hold on to like stay in that space for super extended periods of time. I think it’s like, okay, I processed it, we’re good. Now, one step forward. What’s next?

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah, exactly.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay, what’s your favorite part about running your businesses?

Michelle MacNeil: My favorite part is that I get to dictate. Like I get to build my schedule. Yes, sometimes I’m busier than I want to be, but I get to build my schedule with the fun built right in. Like my mornings are slower so I can take the kid to school and then go wander around my garden with my cup of coffee and just make sure all the things are doing good before I have to come in and be on my computer. And I have breaks in the middle like throughout the day. So, you know, I can eat, pee, do the things.

But then that only takes a couple minutes. I can go outside. I get to mix in whatever I want. I can go see the animals, I can just touch grass, I can just sit in the quiet out here. We all go into business thinking we get freedom and flexibility and then we end up being our own worse boss for a while. But I’ve rediscovered that freedom and flexibility that I really thought was going to be there and once I discovered that you have to build it in, but then you can build it in.

And then I did and I was like, oh, my business is still running and I have this, really? And then you get a little drunk with power on that and all of a sudden, I’m doing the things I want to do in and around the things that need to be done. And I have extra time for when things decide to go sideways, so nothing goes completely off the rails.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Okay, speak to that just quickly because briefly we didn’t talk about that, but the importance of adding in that extra time. What do you mean when you say that and why is it so important?

Michelle MacNeil: I am the queen of buffer time. My calendar is dialed in and there is a lot of gray space because that’s the color for it and that’s just buffer time. I put more in my calendar than I think I’ll need because I never know when something’s going to go wrong, something’s going to break. Right now the kids got all these sports things going on. I put in more time so I know that if life starts lifing or the farm starts farming, I still have protected time later. And then getting hurt recently and slowing right down showed me I needed even more, but that’s the beauty of systems.

Within two weeks, I’d rectified everything and now the rest of the summer has a lot more protected time because we know I’m going to get hurt again. I’m going to do something else dumb. So now I’ve just planned for it. But we tend to plan for us being superhuman. Everything’s going to be great. This monstrous task is going to take me 55 minutes and then I’ll have time to pee and get to my next meeting. Well it’s not. That task is going to take you 3 to 4 hours and you’re not going to do it all today. And that’s all right. But if you haven’t accounted for that in the rest of your week, you’re going to feel shitty by the end of the week.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I have really had to learn that my time blindness is real and this to me has been the answer just putting in like, okay, I think it’s going to take me 20 minutes. Fine. I can think that and also, I’m going to have a hour buffer in my day just in case it takes longer than that.

Michelle MacNeil: Exactly.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love it. All right, so much goodness that we have gone through. Let’s see, what do I want to end with? What is your favorite part about, oh no, two questions. Sorry. What’s your favorite part about the farm, about running the farm?

Michelle MacNeil: Honestly, just the pride you feel going through some of this stuff. We work hard and there’s a lot that goes on here. And we call it peacocking. And so at the end of like a long hot day or a day where we’ve got a project done or just made progress on something or just maybe mowed all the dandelions because they drive my husband nuts. At the end of the day, we just you take a beat and you go outside and we just walk around.

And we call it peacocking because we’re just out there just strutting in everything that is ours, that we created, that we worked so damn hard for, that it’s one of the best pieces. Because you just get to bask in all of it and it gets you to slow down and it’s a great way to practice gratitude at the end of the day and it’s very calming. Animals are so cute and they all kind of get the zoomies around dusk. So like the sheep will play with the lambs and they’ll run around and it’s just the ASMR out here on the farm is pretty incredible. Just sitting and listening to happy animals munching and happy chicken sounds and happy turkey sounds. Very soothing.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: So when you say that, I don’t even know if this is a thing you do, but when you describe it, I’m just picturing you drinking like a cold beer.

Michelle MacNeil: Sometimes, yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Is this happening during the walk? Because that just I don’t know why. I’m not even I’ll like I’ll drink a beer, it’s fine. I prefer wine, but that just feels like a really ice cold beer is perfect for that.

Michelle MacNeil: Some days on those hot summer, okay, I’m Canadian, on those lukewarm summer days that kill us up here, yeah, absolutely. It’s walking around with a cold beer at the end of the day. And I also prefer wine, but in the summer when it’s hot, that doesn’t always go. But yeah, and it’s just taking a walk and appreciating what we’ve done and what we have and reminding ourselves how lucky we are. We could have neighbors and traffic and all the things.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Everyone listening, I feel like this should be your assignment. You can do this even if you’re not walking around your farm. You can do this in your business. It’s such a good practice. I love that. And we shall just all call it peacocking from now on.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Perfect. Okay, last question. Do you have a favorite animal and feel free to name names if it has one?

Michelle MacNeil: It’s hard. Dogs are big babies and we love them. Pumpkin is my daughter’s cat. He’s the one that showed up starving and in need of a home and very small. He is Gabriella’s cat. Mine is the new cat. Her name is Kitty. Her government name is Ziggy Stardust, but we call her Kitty. She’s a little purr machine and she took to me as soon as she got here and I was like, yes, yes, this is the thing. But it’s hard to pick a favorite out. I love all the turkeys, but they’re not here permanently full-time.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: We will not talk about why, but you do have a lot of baby turkeys right now, which has been so far the favorite part of my day recording this podcast with you. First of all, I can hear them. The listeners can probably hear them a little bit. And I got to see some before we started recording and they’re so cute.

Michelle MacNeil: Yeah. I love them.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Do you like them when they get bigger, too?

Michelle MacNeil: I do, they’re not cute anymore, but I love my turkeys. They happy turkey sounds are hilarious.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Are they nice?

Michelle MacNeil: They are. People say that turkeys are aggressive and I’m sure they can be, but these ones, we’re very hands-on. So they’re used to us from the start. We are in with them every day, multiple times a day. They’re funny. They like shiny things, so if you’re wearing jeans, they peck at the shiny things on your jeans. And they follow you around. When my kid walks, they just kind of herd behind her and they just follow her. They like to hang out with the sheep, so they spend their days in the, well when they’re bigger, they’ll spend the days in the pasture with the sheep and they all just get along and hang out.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: I love this. I just love picturing it. It sounds so cute. I am a big fan of all of it. And I’m a huge fan of you. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for doing this. Maybe before I ask where people can find you, which is coming because certainly, we didn’t even talk about LinkedIn. I totally forgot. I didn’t even put it on my list. Maybe we’ll have to record another one. Because Michelle is on LinkedIn, everyone should probably find her there. We’ll get to that in just a second. If someone’s thinking about joining Reimagine, what would you tell them?

Michelle MacNeil: Oh, yeah, just do it. I think when you sent out that Reimagine email, didn’t you say I was like the first person because I think I read it the second it came in because I just happened to be sitting here working and I filled, I could not fill out that intake form fast enough and it was the best decision I’ve made in the past handful of years for my business and not not just my business, but for myself.

Halfway through Reimagine when you did the check-in of where we are and I was like, oh, I suck at this. I’m getting nowhere on these things I want to do within my business. But then it turned out the work wasn’t on my business. The work was on me and I exceeded all expectations with what I’ve done on me. And lo and behold, my business is now following now that I fixed the me problem.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Yes, I was going to say you’ve also had some insane business results in the best way.

Michelle MacNeil: Yes.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: And it’s very fun to coach you because your business is so fun. Thank you.

Michelle MacNeil: Thank you. I’m also a big fan of you and I’m so excited to be here with you.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: So if people want to find you because you do also post animal content, they need to know if they want to come find you. And you have something coming up that you’re going to tell them about. So tell them where to find you and if they want to actually experience some of your your work, where should they go to do that?

Michelle MacNeil: Absolutely. So you can come find me on LinkedIn. You can also join my email list. They get the best baby animal fodder. So the email list is where you really want to be. And at the end of the month, I think it’ll be next week when this comes out on June 29th, I am doing a come plan with me co-planning session for quarter three. It’s 90 minutes of us sitting down together and building out a quarterly plan that is manageable and we’ll make it through when life starts lifing. A plan that will be mapped out across 12 weeks in a non-overwhelming way, so there’s no reason not to get it done while still being able to do all the other things that your life and your business and your world expect of you.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Even if you’re not running a farm.

Michelle MacNeil: Even if you’re not running a farm. But also if you’re running a farm, I do this twice. I do one for my business and then I do one for the farm.

Lindsay Dotzlaf: Oh, that’s good. Okay. So, and these are things that you host every quarter. So even if someone is listening a little bit in the future, as long as you are still in business and still running these, they can still probably go to the link or go to your website and we will put all of the links in the show notes if anybody wants to join. They should absolutely do it because you’re amazing and they’ll learn so much. So, thank you. Thank you. I really appreciate you. I know it is June. You have so much farm stuff going on and I’m just really grateful that you took time to be here with me today and entertain me with farm stories.

Michelle MacNeil: I am always at your disposal for farm stories, but thank you so much for having me. This was so much fun.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Mastering Coaching Skills. If you want to learn more about my work, come visit me at lindsaydotzlafcoaching.com. That’s Lindsay with an A, D-O-T-Z-L-A-F.com. See you next week.