Ep #135: How to Deal with Haters

Hey, this is Lindsay Dotzlaf and you are listening to Mastering Coaching Skills, episode 135.

To really compete in the coaching industry, you have to be great at coaching. That’s why every week, I will be answering your questions, sharing my stories, and offering tips and advice so you can be the best at what you do. Let’s get to work.

Hey, coach, I am so glad you’re here today. I think. I think I’m glad. I have to tell you, recording this feels pretty vulnerable. It’s a little different than things I’ve done before. And so I am glad. I mean, I’m definitely glad you’re listening to the podcast. Hopefully, you will learn a lot from this episode. But as I record it I already, like just hitting record I already feel just a little vulnerable and exposed.

So you’re going to get a side of me today that maybe you’ve not experienced before. And I think that’s good. I think that I try to do this, you know, show different sides of me, be as open and honest with you as I can. And this is just a topic that I have not talked about. And buckle in because here we go. Let’s do it.

I want to be really clear that this is not just about me sharing things about me just to share. Because that’s not useful for you, right? So I have been sitting with this for a bit and really thinking through it and thinking through how do I teach this in a way that is going to be really useful for you? That has nothing to do with me just venting or talking about things that feel uncomfortable or just being vulnerable just to be vulnerable. This is like a pet peeve of mine, I do not love that.

But I do think there’s so much learning that I’ve done around this and it feels really important to share with you. So that’s what I’m going to do today. Hopefully you love it. I would love to hear what you think about this episode. I’m going to say that right now, before I record the rest, before I lose my guts to say it at the end, I guess.

So, what we’re going to talk about today is some haters. And specifically, not just haters, but what to do when you have hate. Or when people disagree with work that you’re putting into the world. Or when people say things to you that just are not kind or you see conversations about yourself that aren’t kind. Or you overhear people saying things that aren’t kind. Or you get an email that is not your favorite. Or just any of those things.

And I’m going to give you some specific examples, some things that I personally have been working through. I’m going to use all of my own examples in this episode, but I’m also going to give you the exact process that I use to work through this stuff and the questions that I ask myself. So hopefully that will be really useful for you.

And before I do that part, one thing I want to say is that I’m not going to edit out, I don’t want to edit out anything that comes up for me. I do think I’ve worked through most of these things and I’m kind of on the other side. I’ve processed lots of emotions. So anything I’m sharing today isn’t a reaction because I try very hard, especially on this podcast, not to be reactionary, not to see something or hear something and think, “Oh my gosh, I have to address this immediately or talk about this immediately.”

It’s just not my style. I really like to sit with things, make sure that they are useful for you. And that if I listen, if I go back and listen maybe two years from now, I’m still going to hear why I thought this podcast was beneficial.

Before I tell the story I want to share something. One reason that I really want to talk about this and that I want to share this with you today is because of something that I see in my coaching practice and that I’ve experienced myself, which is me trying to censor myself or some of my clients sometimes trying to censor themselves in ways that you might not realize that you are.

And because of what I teach, which is coaching skills, I do see a lot of coaches trying to create their own coaching style or use coaching skills that everyone would agree with, right? That everyone is like, “Yes, this is the exact right way to coach.” And I’m sure you’ve heard me talk about this on the podcast before, but I just don’t believe that that’s a thing.

I think that there are so many different coaching styles, so many different ways to coach your clients and some are going to be great for some people and some aren’t, right? So I’ve talked about this when I say how to choose the coach for you, like really find a coaching style that you resonate with.

But I see this happen a lot where when my clients get kind of scared to talk about what they do, or who they are, or how they coach. And they get scared that, oh, but maybe not everyone’s going to like this or some people are going to disagree with it. And that’s part of the reason I really wanted to record this, is to kind of show you no matter who you are, no matter how hard you try to prevent people from disagreeing with you, it just doesn’t work. Like it’s literally impossible.

And I have spent a lot of my life, my entire life not just my coach life, but my entire life just trying to make people happy, trying to be agreeable. And now when it comes to coaching, I like to put stuff into the world that not a lot of people are going to have a hard time with or disagree with. And I can see how that has sometimes affected mostly my marketing and my selling, not so much my coaching because it’s kind of like once you’re in the space, then it’s like, okay, now you’re here, now you get all of me.

But one thing that I’ve really been working on, I don’t know, maybe the past year or so is really just sharing all of myself. And I have been always kind of an open book. And I’ve always said you can ask me anything, I will probably answer it. Especially when I do the Q&A episodes and those types of things. I’ve been a little more vulnerable, shared a little more on those.

But there’s something about this that just feels different and I think it’s because I’ve said like, okay, I’m an open book and you can ask me questions. And so I answer questions about my business, about my personal life, about all the things. But really, when it comes to what I would consider my area of expertise and what this podcast is about, it just gets a little more vulnerable, right?

It’s like when people question those things or say bad things about you when you think, “Oh, I’m really good at this thing,” you just are a little more protective of it maybe. So whoever you are, no matter what your coaching style is, no matter how you work with your clients, I just really hope that this episode gives you some permission to just kind of be yourself and show up that way everywhere. And just be very much in alignment with who you are in the world and who you are as a coach.

It’s so freeing I really think that there’s something about it, that unleashes kind of a next level of coaching mastery, in my opinion. Because you’re no longer holding back and you really just lean into this is who I am, this is some of the things I agree with, here are some of the things I disagree with. And when you do that, you have to be prepared because sometimes people don’t like it. And that is okay. All right?

So what I want to talk about today is something I experienced recently, which it’s actually kind of ironic because this year as I’m recording this in, what month is it? May of 2023. The beginning of this year, we decided that we were going to start Facebook ads. When I say we, I mean my team and I. We decided we’re going to start Facebook ads. And I really prepared myself for this. I was like, oh, I’m scared of the haters. I’m going to get hate for this.

And I really went through worst case scenarios, right? Like, what are the things that I might get hate for? And when I think about what I’ve seen on other people’s ads, a lot of times it’s really, in my opinion, kind of silly stuff. Like people commenting on your appearance or commenting on just things that are like, okay, this has nothing to do with the ad, what’s happening? And then there could also be critique of whatever it is that it says in the ad or whatever, right?

It’s just really different being in front of what I would call a cold audience versus people who are warmer to you, who follow you because they want to, who stick around because they like what you’re doing and they like what you say. And so I really spent some time coaching myself and really working on this, thinking about all the possible things and thinking this is going to be totally fine, right? Like kind of taking the sensitivity out of it and imagining okay, this might happen, this might happen.

So what happened is very fascinating. So I started ads, I did all this work, I felt totally prepared, and I got no hate. No hate on my ads, or I don’t know, at least I haven’t seen it. If I have, maybe my team is deleting it or something. But I’m pretty sure not. But whatever, anyway, I was prepared for it.

And then what happened is that it came, just in a different form and in a different arena, which I think is really fascinating. So I had done all this work to prepare. And in my mind I was preparing myself against strangers, right? Against stranger hate or stranger critique, or whatever you want to call it. And what actually happened was, instead of that, I just had some people that have either worked with me or that I know or that I don’t know because it’s an anonymous type thread, but just hate started showing up.

It was so fascinating. It’s like, oh, I prepared for this and somehow brought it on myself, is a little bit what it felt like. And this is going to happen. I hate to tell you this. I hate to because I know how uncomfortable it is, especially if you’re a person like me. I would never have considered myself to be very sensitive. But what I have noticed is that sometimes I am a little sensitive. And I think it’s almost like the more I’ve been coached and the more self-awareness I have, the more sensitive I am.

I actually don’t think it’s that I am more sensitive, I think it’s that I just allow it instead of covering it up or hiding from it, I just notice it and love this part about myself and accept it about myself. So whether that’s you or not, it doesn’t really matter. I just hope this helps.

So I’m going to give you a little backstory of what happened without names, without major details, because I don’t think that they’re important. But one of the main things that happened is someone messaged me and said, “Hey, do you know about Reddit?” Now, listen, I almost hesitated to even say that. But I know I’ll get a lot of questions like, where is this? Where is it happening?

But I was like, no, I don’t know it. I mean. I’ve heard of Reddit, but I don’t really know what it is or whatever. And they were like, “Oh, well, in a thread about someone else you’re mentioned.” And I was like, okay, whatever, no big deal. But here’s the mistake I made, is that I went on because I downloaded the app. And then I went on and just searched for my name.

Well, just don’t do that. It’s just not a great idea. It’s not fun. It’s probably not how you should spend your time. So then I spent an evening, and there wasn’t actually really a lot. But I spent an evening just reading all these things. I found all these other coaches I know, just reading all this stuff.

And Reddit is an anonymous place, so you just have a username and you can post on there. And there’s all kinds of different threads about different kinds of things. And so I just went down a rabbit hole of reading all this stuff. And it wasn’t really that bad.

But then I made the mistake of mentioning this to someone else. And she unknowingly, one of my colleagues who I’m very close with and this is totally not her fault, but she was like, “Oh, I don’t know if you saw this.” And she sent me screenshots. Because apparently, there was this whole thread about me that she had taken screenshots of and she was planning to share them with me and then decided against it.

And now she’s sending them to me, assuming that I had already seen them. And it was a whole thread, it was like 10 photos or whatever, screenshots. And turns out it had been deleted, which is delightful. Thank you, if it was you. If you posted that thread, thank you for deleting it because I think only the owner of the thread can delete it.

So now I’m reading all of this stuff that I wouldn’t have read otherwise. And this is like specifically about me, not just me in conjunction with other people. And it was so interesting. And so I took a couple days to process all of it. In the meantime, I also just got a couple emails, one from a random person, which I think actually that one did come from the Facebook ads. And then one from someone who was in one of my programs.

And so I think one of the bravest things we can do when we see stuff like this is question it, right? And part of the reason I think this feels a little cathartic and maybe very vulnerable for me is it’s one of those things like once we put it out there, that now it’s like okay, well, here’s all of the truth. Now, anything that anyone says isn’t going to, like they can’t say anything that I haven’t said, right? So I’m just going to address it.

But the point of me addressing it is specifically to show you how I’ve worked through it and the questions I asked myself and the process that I’ve gone through to handle it. Because, again, it’s probably something that’s going to happen for all of you. And or maybe you’re on the other side of this. And I would just offer that if that’s you and you are the person doing things like this, or you have been pulled, felt pulled to do something like this or to talk about other coaches or to whatever.

I think coaching, I’ve said this before, is a really interesting industry because so many of us are promoting what we do on social media. And so it just kind of puts it out there in a way that you don’t see in other industries. Like we’re kind of skirting the line. I would by no means consider myself an influencer, but I think some coaches do kind of skirt that line because we are showing up so much on social media, right?

So here are the questions I ask myself when I see, and again I’m going to give you very specific examples and read you some of the things that have been said and kind of show you how I worked through this process. So here are the questions. Ready?

First one, is it true? Second, is it kind? Third, do I want to do something about it? And if the answer to that is yes, then my next question is, when? I’ll dive more into each of these and tell you I ask them. Next one, is there anything here for me to process?

So that might mean like an emotion or something that’s coming up that I need to sit with before I can do anything about it or react to it. I think that keeps you from being reactionary to something like, what do I need to process? What do I need to sit with for now? Is there growth here for me? And then the last question, is this something I would want to share with my clients? And that’s like is there something teachable here? Can I use this in any way to help my clients, which is what I’m doing with this whole podcast.

So I’m just going to read you some of the things. So I got an email and it said, again, I think this is someone who found my Facebook ads and who somehow found my email address and sent me an email. And the email said, “Oh great, just another white woman telling me what to do.” Now. Let’s just go through the questions.

Is it true? Well, kind of. I mean, I’m very white. I don’t know if you have seen a photo of me. But there’s nothing I can do about this. I’m very pale, I burn in five minutes. Like this is a thing. It is a thing I get made fun of for by all my amazing friends who have darker skin than I do, which is pretty much everyone. Yes, I am, I’m a white woman. That part is totally true.

Now, add on the telling me what to do piece and that’s where it’s like, no, I’m never telling anyone what to do. If anything, and honestly, I wish I knew what this email was in response to because it may have been more helpful or I may have been able to respond to it. In this case, I just didn’t because what do you say to that, right?

I’m absolutely never telling anyone what to do. I am sharing my knowledge with the world. If it’s something that you want to learn and want to work on, you come work with me or listen to the podcast or whatever. But if you don’t want to, absolutely don’t do it and that is okay.

But the one thing that did come up with this email – So when I asked myself, do I want to do something about it? I sat with this for a minute. And honestly, this one, I didn’t feel very activated by this because it was just like there’s not a lot, right? Oh, so is it true? I answered that.

Is it kind? My answer was like, not the kindest, right, because this one feels like middle of the road. It’s not the most kind because there’s really just not a lot I can do. And it wasn’t offering any kind of feedback that isn’t just like, you know, that was really anything I can change.

But do I want to do something about this? One thing that came up for me when I just kind of sat with this and explored my thoughts around it and wrote down some things that were coming up for me, one thing I realized is that I used to, one thing I used to do a lot in my business and as a coach is really promote and uplift other coaches.

And I still do that. I do it here, obviously I interview people on the podcast. And I do it on social media, I’m always posting about things that other coaches are doing. But it did give me this idea of like, I haven’t really been very focused on that. I used to focus on it a lot. I haven’t been as focused on it. How do I double down on that, right?

How do I bring more of that? Because I do think it’s so important, especially as a white woman, to promote and uplift so many other voices and faces and all of that in the industry. I think it is one of the things about the coaching industry that is really powerful, is the potential for diversity. Whether that’s diversity in actual humans, diversity in coach backgrounds, in just all of it, right? In training, in methods, in whatever.

So from this, I’ve actually created something new for my Instagram, which I’m really excited about that you’ll see if you follow me on Instagram. I’m going to start spotlighting many, many, many of my clients. And not just the ones in my mastermind, which is usually who I talk to on the podcast, which we’ll get to in a minute because that was another thing that I got.

But just even brand new coaches, right? And for nothing in return besides just me saying check out this coach. Kind of saying, look at all of these amazing, diverse humans that are in the coaching industry that you should pay attention to. I think that that is something that’s very important.

So that was something kind of fun that came out of this, is like me just noticing, oh yeah, I haven’t been focused on this as much. How do I kind of put a spotlight back on this? And kind of use, you know, as my business grows, how do I use that to really bring everyone with me, to uplift so many different voices in the industry? I feel so strongly about that. So it’s something I’ve always done, it just helped me really refocus on that. So that’s coming.

The next thing, I had a couple of emails kind of around – This all happened, it was really interesting, all within like two weeks of each other. I had a couple emails. Actually, the Coach Lab, I’ve been enrolling clients. It’s been open for over a year and I had a couple of emails that were like, “Hey, excuse me, you said these videos were going to be in here. They’re not here. You’re not delivering what you said.”

Now, at first I was like, what are you talking about? And I felt a little defensive, right, because the Coach Lab, I love it. It’s like my baby and it was like someone’s saying something’s wrong with your baby. And I was like, what? This can’t be true. But I looked into it. Turns out, it is true.

Second question, is it kind? Yeah, it was pretty neutral. It wasn’t unkind, for sure. And this isn’t necessarily even the same category as some of the others. But some of you do process stuff like this as hateful or in ways that feel really bad to you. So I did want to include this one because it was just feedback, right? Some of you take feedback very personally, and I did for just a second until I went down this road. Is that true? It turns out, it was. No one has told me for a year, how does that happen?

Was it kind? Not unkind, it was just neutral? Do I want to do something about it? Yes. 1,000% I do, because those videos should be there. Am I doing something about it? Yes. So the question is when, as soon as possible. So that’s what we’re doing. I’m actually in the process of redoing a lot of the Coach Lab videos. So it is uncomfortable to not fix it immediately and just stick another video in there, but I really just took note of it and have added it into the videos that I’m already redoing.

It’s also something that I could have sworn I recorded when I recorded the Coach Lab videos. So it was really weird to me. It was like that’s why my initial reaction was this can’t be true. Is there anything here for me to process? Yeah, but that happened pretty quickly. It was like I saw the discomfort of the feedback and just quickly moved through it. And I was like, no, this is true. She’s right, we do need to get this video in there.

Is there growth for me here? Again, yeah, probably true, right? It’s like, oh, I should have, I want to be more careful. Make sure that all videos, maybe go back through, edit, make sure that everything I say is there, is going to be there. Is this something I can share with my clients? Yeah, I always share with my clients when I fail. And this specifically affects clients, so yes.

One reason, I forgot to say this at the beginning of the episode, one reason that I also wanted to record this is because sometimes some of you who know me and who know me in person say things like, yeah, but you never get hate or like people don’t disagree with you. And so that’s part of the other reason, I think, because I have just kind of a personality that is fairly easy to get along with, I’m not very reactive, I’m not usually putting out things into the world that I know is going to get a big rise out of people.

And so I do see what they’re saying, in the most loving way. And I also just kind of want to show you that that isn’t true. That it doesn’t matter how agreeable you think I am as my friends or as my clients, there’s still a chance that people are going to disagree or whatever. So if it can happen to me, it can also happen to you.

All right, the next one. You’ve heard me talk about this before, but I have had some emails that are like, I don’t like your voice or you talk too slow. And so when I go through the questions, is that true? No. I mean, I know it’s true for them, I guess, right? This is one of those like, okay, this is clearly just someone else’s opinion. I know it’s an opinion because I’ve had people also say the opposite.

So that’s important for me to see, for my brain to take in like, okay, one person says they don’t like my voice, I talk too slow. Other people say, oh my gosh, I love your voice. I love that you have a podcast, it just always calms me right down, right? So is it true? No, it’s just an opinion.

Is it kind? No, not really, because there’s nothing I can do about it. I could decide, okay, I’m going to talk faster, but it just doesn’t work with my brain, right? It’s like there’s something that happens in my brain when I’m processing things as I’m saying them. Even when I write out an entire episode or I write out a training I’m doing, I still sometimes talk slowly.

Now, on most podcast apps there’s the button that you can put it on two times speed or one and a half or whatever. And in the Coach Lab, that’s also a thing. So don’t let it deter you. If you think I talk slow, don’t let it deter you from working with me because you can just fast forward. That’s okay.

Now this one, I actually did a lot of work on this. So is there anything for me to process? Is there any growth for me here? I actually did a lot of work on this before I started the podcast because I knew this was a thing.

And this is very common. So I’ll just say really quickly for any of you that have a podcast or that are starting a podcast or thinking of starting a podcast, don’t let your voice, your thoughts about your voice be the thing that stops you from doing it. Because what I will say is over time, being more and more and more exposed to my voice, my own voice because I sometimes have to listen to playbacks or clips or whatever, you just get used to it.

Now, it sounds weird and I’m sure you know this, but it sounds weird because in your head, this is not what your voice sounds like. So then you hear it and you’re like, that is not my voice. But it is. This is how other people hear it and it’s just a weird thing that your brain is trying to process. But the more you are exposed to it, the more it’s just like, oh yeah, that’s just what I sound like. Now I have no thoughts about my voice.

All right, so those are the ones that felt a little lighter. So let’s get into some of the other ones. Are you ready? The next one, you only make money because of someone else’s success. So this is not a thing that was said to me, it was a thing that I read about myself, “She only makes money because of someone else’s success, because she’s like in this other container and that coach promotes her.”

So I have a couple of things to say about that. And this is the one that I really had to sit with, especially the first question. Is it true? For me, the short answer for that is no. But there’s nuance to it and I actually want to share it with you because I think it might be very helpful.

The answer definitely isn’t yes, right? It’s not like oh, yes, that is the only reason I made money. But I do think that there is a skill that I use that is teachable that you could use to take away from this if you wanted to.

The next question, is it kind? No, in this case no, it was not kind. It wasn’t said in a kind way. The entire thread was not kind. And just my personal one thought that I will just share is if you’re sharing anything in a thread, an anonymous thread, like you think you have to use an anonymous place to share things, what you’re saying probably isn’t kind. So let’s just start there.

Do I want to do something about it? No, from the standpoint of am I going to change what I’m doing or do something about it? No, but is there anything here for me to process? Yes, there was a lot for me to process. What do I think about this is true? Why does it feel so bad for someone to say it? So I did all of that. I sat for days with all the stuff that came up.

Is there growth for me here? Yes, absolutely. And is there something I can share with my clients? 1,000% yes. So, for me, the growth is seeing, finding the truth in it, right? What is true in this case? Because when you can find the truth, then it really does take the heaviness out of it, the heavy emotions because you can then work through it instead of putting it back on the top shelf of the closet and slamming the door shut and walking away. You can really work through like, okay, what is true?

So here’s what I think is true about this. And one thing that I feel like I should preface it with this, one thing that I found very interesting about some of the threads and some of the things that I read about myself is that from what I gathered, none of the people that were saying the things have ever worked with me. And so that’s just something for me to consider, right? It’s like, okay, they’re just saying things for whatever reason, who knows why. And I just get to decide how I want to react.

But I also think one of them was a colleague who is, was, is a friend, and that felt really weird, right? So that was also a piece of it for me to process. But the biggest thing that came up for me when I was thinking through this is, here’s maybe what people don’t know, the business coach that I work with, she’s also a really good friend. And she was also my very first coach and I was her very first client. She coached me on every single thing in my life.

She was just a general life coach when I hired her. And I have grown with her, right? Which is very different than let’s say I hire a very successful coach, I become really good friends with them. And then I’m like, “Hey, promote my stuff.” That’s not what happened.

But the other side of it, and I think the side that is really important for me to see and for you to think about too if this is you, is it doesn’t matter who promotes your work. If you’re not good at what you do, you aren’t going to keep being successful. You aren’t going to make money.

You might make some money from it but you’re not going to make that much because people are going to be like, “Ooh, yikes, this thing that I bought is terrible. She doesn’t know what she’s doing, she’s only here because she’s friends with this person.” So there’s all of that.

And then the other piece of it is, I think the skill to learn as a coach and what you can take away from this is how can you create that for yourself? Not by necessarily being friends with someone, but how do you put yourself in spaces? And I think this is the thing that I’m good at, great actually at doing. I’ve done it my whole life. How do you put yourself in scenarios or in spaces that will benefit you?

And I tell my clients this all the time, right? So let’s say you are a parenting coach and you ask me, how do I find clients? One thing, like one answer that I always give is not by only being in rooms full of coaches. You want to be in rooms full of parents, full of your ideal clients, right? Not there like poaching clients necessarily, but just creating relationships, delivering value.

That is how I built my business. Through connection, through giving value continuously over and over and over and over. And so many of my very first clients, up to hundreds of thousands of dollars, have nothing to do with the spaces that I was in, they were all just from my life, just people in my life. And so I think for someone to say, oh, the only reason you make money is because of this, is just 100% not true in the way that they meant it.

But hopefully that feels helpful for you. Because just think about instead of that being a bad thing, like how can you create that for yourself, right? How can you be – Like one thing that I always say is I’m here to be the best student. I have that no matter what room I’m in.

I also surround myself with a lot of coaches. I do lots of trainings. I have several certifications. I’m always looking to be the best student, which means I’m also always growing and expanding my coaching network. So for you, think about that. How can you do that? Where are your people? Where are your clients?

And there’s just a fine line between just being there to contribute to the community versus being there to sign clients. And I’ve always been the one to do the first one, right? Like, I’m usually there for myself, I’m here to be the best student versus being there for signing clients or getting clients.

All right, the next one, “You only interview successful clients on your podcast.” This is an email I got from someone and I think she was actually trying to pitch me to be on my podcast. I thought it was very interesting because she gave me some compliments and then she said this thing. So it felt very much like a kind of a backhanded compliment. Is that what you call it?

And it was fascinating to me, because I was like, well, first of all, this is not the way, don’t do that. Putting me down is probably not the best way to be on my podcast. But when I really thought about this, was it true? My answer to that is, yeah, it is true. And the reason that it’s true is because I really think that all of my clients that I’m picking from are successful in their own way.

And when it comes to my podcast, the way I – Actually let me go through a couple of the other questions first. It was kind of neutral. It wasn’t the most kind. Do I want to do something about it? So when I think about this, I think maybe I just need to be more clear about how I pick people to be on my podcast, which I’ll do right now. So that’s what I’m going to do about it. When? I’m going to do it right now and tell you.

Is there anything here for me to process? The answer was yes, but it didn’t take long. It was just a noticing of like, okay, actually yeah, this is partially true. And all this did was make me direct my focus to this and really think about how I choose people to be on my podcast.

Is there growth for me here? I think the growth honestly, in this one is just allowing someone to dislike something that I’m doing or believe things that aren’t true about me, which let’s just be clear has been my growth for years. And I see it. I always see it. It always comes up and I’m like, “Oh, there’s this thing again, so fun.”

And is it something I want to share with my clients? Sure, because if you have podcasts, if you have testimonials, if you have whatever, this will be something that you are also coming up against, right, like how to pick.

So I’ll just tell you right now how I pick, and it’s probably not what you think it is. Because when I think about my most successful clients, I don’t really have a way to measure, like I can’t line up, I don’t know how much a lot of my clients make because I don’t have a business mastermind where we’re strictly talking about money.

All I know is how they show up in my containers, how they participate. And when they’re talking about, oh, this thing that we’re working on really resonates with me and I can see a big shift.

But when it comes to that, one thing that has always been very uncomfortable for me since I started my podcast is I just can’t interview everyone. It’s literally impossible. I also know that those of you listening, half of you love interviews and half of you don’t. I would say it’s about 50/50. And I’m the same when I listen to people’s podcasts. Sometimes I love an interview, but sometimes I don’t.

So when I’m picking people to be on my podcast I’m thinking about, is there something here to add to the conversation? Can we talk about something that I’ve never talked about on my podcast before that I think will be very beneficial to my audience, to the people listening? Is it something teachable, as in the people that are listening, you, you that are listening, will you take something away from this and feel like you can apply it possibly to your coaching right now? That always feels really big to me.

Is there something that stands out about this person or about some work that they’ve done that I want them to share? Those are all very different questions than who’s my most successful client or who’s going to say the nicest things about me or my spaces? Those just aren’t things I’m thinking about.

All right, next one, “You have fails you don’t talk about.” Okay, I’m not going to spend a lot of time on this. Is it true? Of course it’s true. You guys would be exhausted if all I did was get on here and tell you about all my fails. It would be exhausting. Why? Because there are so many. So many. Anyone that has a very successful business as an entrepreneur, so many fails, like line them up. There are just so many, I wouldn’t even know where to start.

The only time I share them, because I’ve seen some people do this. And sometimes it can verge on being a little indulgent, right? Being a little like, “Oh, I fail all the time and so it’s okay for you too.” Yeah, totally that’s a thing. And if that is all I’m sharing, then what is there to take away besides that, right, besides it’s okay to fail?

The other thing I don’t do is I don’t talk about fails when I’m still really in the middle of processing them. So if I feel highly emotional about something or if I’m really down, I wait till I’m out of that piece to talk about it because it doesn’t feel like I have anything to teach when I’m in that, right? For me, it’s like the value for you as the listener is how did I get out of that? What happens on the other side? What did I learn through the fail? All of that.

So that kind of answers a lot of the things about my podcast, really is I just never share anything when I’m in the middle of it. I will share it when I’m on the other side and when I fully process it myself, because I think that’s where the value is for you.

The next one. Let’s see, “What you teach is just a clone of other things.” So this was in a thread on Reddit. “What she teaches is just a clone of other things. I don’t get it, I don’t get the appeal.” Okay, this one actually made me laugh. This one actually didn’t activate me really at all.

This was one that I was like, “Okay, it is what it is,” right? And here’s why, because I have a thought that is no thought that I have is unique, or nothing I teach is unique. As in, it’s all been done before. Everything in the world is just a reframing of something else.

Now, I wouldn’t say that’s 100% true, but for the most part. And this actually comes from my background in science and in research because in research, a lot of what you’re doing is building off of other people’s ideas, right? There’s never, hardly ever, I’m sure we could come up with some tiny examples. But there’s hardly ever a time when we’re like, this is a thing that no one has ever talked about in the history of the world. It’s just not a thing.

And so this thought actually really helps me. Nothing I teach is 100% unique to me. Now, my good friend has a thought that is the opposite, everything I teach is unique to me. And what I would say is they’re both totally true, and you just get to pick the one that serves you.

For me, I am very prone to wanting to be really good at things, wanting to kind of show my significance by being great at something and being an expert at something. And so this thought really helps me because it keeps me out of my head. It keeps me out of over analyzing something, overthinking about things, and just putting it out there.

But what I also know is that although I believe nothing I teach is a brand new idea that’s being birthed into the world and that other people have probably said it before and that they teach it in different ways. What I will add to that is no one can do it in the same way I do because I’m the only me, right?

So that’s good news for you, because that means whatever it is that you’re teaching, whatever it is that you’re an expert at, even if other people are teaching it, no one will teach it in the exact same way that you do. No one will coach your clients in the exact same way as you, because you are unique. Every person is unique, right?

So whatever style it is that you’re coaching in, however it is that you’re showing up for your clients, that is unique to you. And I think that that’s really important. So, for me, this was one I kind of laughed about because I was like, yeah, sure, like, these ideas have definitely been done before. And there are people, there are coaches who just want to learn from me and the way I teach things.

I am also very careful. I said I’ve had a lot of trainings and I’ve had some certifications, and I’m very careful. I’m never teaching, like anytime you come into my space you will see this, I’m never just regurgitating material.

I’ve even had people email me and say, “Hey, I’ve done this specific certification, can I come into your space and learn how to be better at this particular modality?” And I say, “No, that’s not what we’re doing here. That would be silly. Go learn that from wherever you learned it. Right? Go learn to be better at that from the people teaching that exact thing.”

Okay, and then the last one, and some of you have been blowing me up about this and I’ve been ignoring you because remember, I said I don’t share things until I’m on the other side. So the last one, and this was the main thing that I saw when I searched my name was, “You only stay in your mentor’s mastermind because that’s how you make money.” So that was one piece of it. And then the other piece of it was, “And because she’s your friend.”

So here’s what I’m going to say about that. Is it true? 100% no. And I feel so confident saying that, especially now. Especially now that I’m out of some of the drama around some things that happened in that space and me being a little confused and watching it all kind of go down and thinking like, “Whoa, I’m friends with all these people. What’s happening?”

I don’t like it when people fight. And it felt like I was in the middle of a divorce. And I would never stay in a place where I thought the coaching wasn’t good for me, or that the coaching wasn’t good for other people, or that there was somehow harm being done. Like that is just true.

We’ve also already talked about me making money from being in there. Yes, it is a coaching community. Yes, sometimes I have clients that overlap. But the other is also true, a lot of my clients go work with coaches that I’ve worked with. So, first of all, that goes both ways. But it might surprise you to know that a big percentage of my clients, it actually sometimes does surprise people, I think, when I’m like, no, I have maybe a handful of –

Actually, I’ll just be really specific. So this round of certification that I’m currently hosting right now, there are I think four or five people from my mentor’s mastermind that overlap. And that’s fascinating to me. That’s actually the highest number that there’s ever been. Usually it’s like one or two.

So I don’t know what is different about this round, but I myself even thought that was interesting and a little like, oh, what created this? So there’s that piece of it, right? Which is separating out like, okay, that’s not true. But what is true is that I know, like if I search deep down in myself, one of my highest values in life is freedom and autonomy.

And because of that, I am very particular about what I do, about doing things just because someone else thinks I should or whatever. I’m so against that. Actually, if anything, my personality is very much like I’ll rebel against that. Every time I rejoin the business mastermind that I’m in, I recommit. I check in with myself. Is this what I want to do? Like it’s always on the table that maybe it’s not.

So at this point, while I’m recording this, I’m still in it. And because of that, I just would say I would never compromise my values or who I am as a person just because, oh, if I’m in this space I make more money. Or if I didn’t want to hurt her feelings, that doesn’t make any sense. We would be friends, no matter what.

I also think, and this is just to speak to people that are like, “Then why do you stay?” I have a huge belief that we all make mistakes. And I’m not talking about my mentor, I’m talking about my mentor and anyone that was involved in people leaving the mastermind and whatever, people involved in this Reddit thread, like all the things.

I really think we all make mistakes. I think the comeback or how you correct it is more important. I always give people grace for that because that’s what I would want. I know that I will make mistakes. I know I will. And I just think that that is such an important piece, especially as coaches. I just find it so interesting when coaches decide on something and then they’re like, now this is just the truth of the universe, right? Like this coach is bad, this style is bad, this thing is bad.

I just don’t understand that because as coaches we know that people change, people grow, people evolve. And I think that’s one of the most amazing things about coaching. So to me, the more interesting conversation is what has come from that, right? I want to be around to see that piece. And that’s what I’m doing. And that coach still has my full support.

And why I couldn’t talk about it before, when I was really in the middle of it, is I just had so many emotions about all the things that were happening and opinions and whatever. And just so much of it is just not my story to share, period. Like at all, it has nothing to do with me.

There’s no reason I should have to explain why I’m in the spaces that I’m in. There’s no reason that I should have to defend myself or my coach, or any of my colleagues. That has nothing to do with anything here, it’s just a distraction.

So the more I talk about that here on my podcast, the more of a distraction it is. I also think that when you work with coaches, it doesn’t mean you agree with everything that they say or do. So, for me, I think the more important skill for anyone to develop is that skill of questioning like, is this what I want? Is this the style I love? Is it not? If not, why not? What am I looking for? What do I want in a coach?

To me, that’s the most important piece. And so for anyone listening, I just want you to know that is how I make my decisions and it’s how I will always make my decisions.

Okay, so let’s bring it back to what to do when someone says something about you that isn’t true or isn’t kind, how to handle it. Check in with yourself. First, is this thing true? Second, is it kind? Because sometimes it can be true and not kind in the way it’s delivered, right? It’s the difference between calling someone out versus calling them in.

It’s the difference between being hateful versus, hey, I don’t know if you know this, I’m here to help you if you want it, or here’s this feedback if you want it. That’s calling someone in, versus calling out is just being a little more hateful about it.

So is it true? Is it kind? Is there something I want to do about this? And if yes, when? Is there anything here for me to process? And what is my growth? What is the growth here for me? Is this something I want to share with my clients?

The last thing I want to say that I want to leave you with just in case you’ve ever been the person on the other side of this, the person that’s maybe talking about other people, talking about other coaches. I just want to lovingly call you in for just a second. Gather around, let me tell you something.

Here are my thoughts about this behavior. First, it’s not very nice. This is like conversations I have with my kids sometimes, right? Like I know you want to say it, but maybe don’t because it’s not nice. And I would just encourage you, and this is really me being serious not snarky, if you have ever behaved like this or if you have pronounced your judgments on other coaches out into the world, first of all, this is totally normal behavior.

Our brains love to find those judgments, right? To find what other people are doing wrong, to think how can I correct this? And what I would just say about that is just don’t spend any time thinking about me ever, like truly. Or hopefully it’s probably not me if you’re here listening to this podcast and you’re now 45 minutes in or however long this is.

But whoever it is, what would change if you just let go of that totally? If you just noticed it, noticed your judgments, and then just redirected your attention back to what it is that you’re doing. I promise you, you’re going to make such a bigger impact on your clients, on the world, on whatever it is that you’re trying to make an impact on.

You’re going to have such a bigger impact when you are putting your genius out into the world. Not putting your genius out into the world, using the juxtaposition against something else to promote what it is. You don’t have to be against anything to be for whatever it is that you’re teaching. I think it makes your marketing better. It makes you better at problem solving and really thinking deeply about your clients. And overall, which of course this is my mission, it really makes your coaching better, right?

So find a friend that you can be catty with, that you can say all the things to because that’s normal behavior. We all do it. Even I have catty thoughts and say snarky things. But I say them to a couple close friends and it’s like offloading it and then I just move on, right? Because I don’t ever want to draw your attention to something else instead of just being here and sitting with what it is that I am teaching you and what it is that I’m helping you create.

So, I love you, carry on, go do your work in the world. And no matter which side of this you have been on, everything’s going to be okay. You’ve got this. You’re a genius and an expert. Let’s go.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Mastering Coaching Skills. If you want to learn more about my work, come visit me at lindsaydotzlafcoaching.com. That’s Lindsay with an A, D-O-T-Z-L-A-F.com. See you next week.