To really compete in the coaching industry, you have to be great at coaching. That’s why every week, I will be answering your questions, sharing my stories, and offering tips and advice so you can be the best at what you do. Let’s get to work.

Lindsay: Hello, I am so excited that we are doing this today. Okay, first you’ve been on before, so briefly introduce yourself. And we’re going to tell them why we are here doing this again with you on the podcast, which is so fun.

Danielle: Yeah, so Danielle Savory, sex coaching for women. Just helping you get out of your head, into your body. Understanding all of the things that make it so our pleasure is inaccessible. And I’m a BFF of Lindsay Dotzlaf, that’s why we’re here, hanging out bringing you all the nuggets and wisdom from Mexico.

Lindsay: Yes. So that leads into what I want to tell them to start with. Which is we are actually in Mexico recording this podcast, together but separate. We are actually in our own rooms because of tech, whatever. We thought it would be easier this way.

But we’ve been together. We’ve been here a couple days. And we have been talking a lot about just how nice it is to have best friends and be here together and be in it at the same time. In it like in all the things, right? All the growth, all the drama, all the everything. And we just thought it’d be really fun to record this for you today, just while we’re like really in the experience of being together.

Danielle: Yes, yeah. And the experience of, like you said, the growth, the drama, the breakthroughs real time. Might as well capture it all.

Lindsay: Yeah. So where do you want to start? What do you want to talk about first? We talked through a few things, we had some ideas. And I think one thing that really has come up since we’ve been here that we’ve been talking about is just, like I said, the importance of having your people.

Whether they’re in person or just people you can reach out to. But we’ve talked about this a little in the past, but let’s just explore it a little more today. Do you want to start there?

Danielle: Yeah, let’s do it. Honestly even looking at this trip and my journey as an entrepreneur, as a coach, I don’t know, and I’m saying this with full honesty, if I would be where I am without the support of my coach friends, my colleagues, my best friends that are in it too. That is the honest truth. How I see it is like someone that you can really be vulnerable with and totally transparent with.

And it’s not like we’re withholding things from our audience or our clients or anything like that. But it’s that extra level of trust. And that’s that extra level of sharing that you want to do with one another and the vulnerability. And letting them see all of your fears, all of your doubts, all your insecurity.

I personally have been going through a lot of mental drama this year. I mean, it’s always mental drama, right? But a lot of anxiety, a lot of insecurity, and having my people that I can call and speak to about it and speak into it, and not be hidden, and not have to be on like talking like a coach.

Because I think sometimes as coaches we always want to immediately coach ourselves or get out of it or work on your coaching. And the beautiful breakthrough that just can happen just by being your full messy human self with your friends, and crying about all of the things and doubting all of the things and being very dramatic about all of the things first, before you dive into the coaching is really just such a gift.

Lindsay: Yes. Or just not even diving into the coaching at all sometimes, right?

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: Just like, “Well, here we just are. This is us today, this is where I am. I’m feeling terrible and I do not want to be coached out of it yet.”

Danielle: Yes, yet exactly.

Lindsay: And maybe even like I don’t want to be coached out of it from you.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: Like I’ll talk to my coach about it, right now I just need a friend and a hug.

Danielle: Yeah. And I think that’s such a good point that you say because I think you and I do a really good job about that. It’s like when we’re calling and we’re in it, like do you want me to share with you as a coach or as a friend? And I think that’s so important, we always are asking each other permission and what did you call for before.

Because when we have our coach hat on, the way we would speak to one another, as incredible coaches that we are, is totally different oftentimes than the way that we would talk to each other as a friend. And sometimes you want just a friend. Sometimes I’m like, “Lindsey, just be my friend and then coach me.”

Lindsay: Yes.

Danielle: And you can feel it and you’re like, “Okay, now I’m ready for the coaching. I’m ready to get coached.”

Lindsay: I didn’t actually think of this when we started talking about this. But the very last podcast episode I recorded is actually about how to know when your client isn’t ready to move out of the thing. So like when they’ve experienced something, like they’re highly emotional because of something that has happened very recently, right?

It’s like a fresh thing. And not talking about past trauma and that type of thing. But even just a fresh thing, you know that at some point, they’re probably going to want coaching on it. But when they come to the call and it has just kind of just happened and they’re highly emotional, when it is appropriate, as a coach to just kind of listen and just explore like, How are you feeling? Do you actually want to feel differently? Do you want to not feel this negative emotion?

Because sometimes the negative emotion, when you want to believe that the thing that happened was bad the negative emotion is appropriate.

Danielle: Yeah, I think we need to feel it. And that’s one of the things, you know, the difference. And I personally can feel it, like when you’re like, “Are you kidding? No, absolutely, I do not want coaching.”

Lindsay: That’s like do you want to punch in the face? How about that, it’s like the same question.

Danielle:  Yeah, you’re like, “Please, yeah, make it worse.” But, yeah, it’s like that soft, safe, secure place. And usually when you give somebody permission, whether it is a friend or a client, to just be there and say all the things and cry if they need to and let that really, really be there, it can process out of the body. It can move through.

And then from this more neutral, less triggered place you’re able to receive the coaching. Because if you’re in that highly emotional state, no coaching is going to work. It’s just not going to stick.

Lindsay:  Yeah, it’s so true. And I want to also reiterate the thing that you said earlier. I completely agree with you, I don’t think that I would be at the same place in my business, in my life, in all the things if it wasn’t for you and for our other friends, our other coaches who are kind of our best friends.

And it’s something that I encourage when people come in, even to my mastermind, it’s one of the things that I say. The very first thing I have them do is set the top two to three goals that they want to work on in the mastermind. And that’s one of the examples that I get when I’m saying like, “Okay, obviously, everyone’s here to work on their coaching. That’s why you came, but what are the other things? Do you need coach friends? Do you need to not feel so alone in this industry where you’re talking to people all day, but ultimately by yourself a lot?”

Danielle: Yes. Yeah. And I think having those coach friends and having somebody, like we just talked about being able to hold that emotional space when you’re in it, but just also call you on your shit.

Lindsay: Yeah, and knowing the difference.

Danielle:  And knowing the difference. And it goes both ways and it’s so helpful. I mean there’s so many conversations where it’s like when you know somebody so well you know those places that are almost like a sinkhole or like a quicksand.

Like you know me so well you know when I’m like quick sanding into my kind of thing as I compare and despair and feeling awful about myself because my brain has gotten trapped in comparing myself to other people. And you’re like, “Yeah, but and also…”

You can pull me kind of out of that, because you see me going down into that sinkhole so much quicker just because we know each other so well. We understand each other’s patterns. We understand each other’s places where we get trapped into mentally. And when you have friends, when you have somebody to reach out to that knows you like that, you can kind of be pulled out of the chasm way faster than normal.

Lindsay: Yeah, and I love the analogy you just gave because also it’s like, I might throw the rope in and then maybe it’s like you don’t grab it. And I’m like, “Okay, that’s fine. I’ll just be here with you for a minute. I’ll just jump in it with you, we’re going to be okay. I’m just going to hold your hand until we get out of it.” And then you’ll be like, “Okay, I’m ready to grab the rope.”

Danielle: Yeah. Okay, let’s get out of here, that’s fine.

Lindsay: Okay, so I think something that’s so interesting to explore, and I did get your permission about this before we started. This actually comes up a lot in my mastermind as well, is the idea of just belonging. And belonging, thinking you belong in a group, thinking you belong in a mastermind, thinking you belong wherever. This can really in any piece of your life.

But you and I have been talking about this. I’m so always curious about it and it fascinates me because this is just not my go-to thing. Mine is almost the total opposite, which is also not great. It’s like I belong everywhere, and whatever, I can do it by myself, so I don’t need you anyway, like that’s my go-to thought.

Danielle: It’s like middle finger to you all. Watch me bitches, I’ll be over here blazing own trail.

Lindsay: That’s right. Yeah, so it just shows up differently. It’s a variation of the same thought I just react to it very differently. But for you, this is something that you and I have been talking about a lot lately. I want you to kind of take over for a minute and just talk about what are your thoughts about belonging? Where do you think this idea that you don’t belong?

Which, by the way, you know how I feel about this. It’s like the craziest thought that you’ve ever had. And anyone that’s listening that knows you is like, “Wait, what? Danielle Savory feels like she doesn’t belong?”

Danielle: Yeah, pretty much all the time. I mean, to be honest, this has been a recurring belief and thought that I’ve had since childhood. It can be traced back to the days of like, I remember specifically in second grade there was this new girl. And she was new to the school and she was having a slumber party that everybody was talking about.

And I wasn’t invited. I was like the one person that wasn’t invited. And I was like, “I don’t belong.” And she was like, “We just don’t have enough soda” or something. I was like, “I’ll bring my own soda, it’s totally fine.”

Lindsay: Oh my god.

Danielle: Now, having girls that age I’m like, heartbreaking.

Lindsay: Are you just like, “Listen, you will never bring your own soda. If anybody says that to you, they’re not your friend.”

Danielle: I was like, “You don’t want to go.” Anyway, this girl ends up being, she’s still one of my best and longest friends. And we laugh about that conversation on the playground.

Lindsay: Of course.

Danielle: But think it was just this idea that was planted younger. In middle school I was bullied a lot, so much so that my parents had to go to the school multiple times to try and talk to the school because they were worried about my safety. And I couldn’t ride the bus anymore, because of the violence towards me. Like, it was definitely a lot of bullying.

And I think at that time in your life, when your brain is growing and you’re developing these beliefs of how you fit into society, because neuro scientifically this is when we start to look more towards our peers to belong versus our family. And so it’s a very crucial time in our development, developing these beliefs.

And I just think like one of my core “wounds” is feeling like I don’t belong. And it’s really coming from this thought of like, “Oh, they’re all thinking these horrible negative things about me.” I have that belief often.

Lindsay has asked like, “Do you actually think?” And I was like, “My brain really does.” She was like, “Like what?” And I can just spit off like a novel of the types of thoughts or things I think that people are having. When really, it’s just showing my own thoughts and my own beliefs that I’m having towards myself, where it’s not feeling like I’m accepting of those things.

Which is so much why my work is within self-compassion, because I’m so intimately involved with that inner mean girl that isn’t letting me belong in my own body and isn’t letting me belong here.

So it comes up a lot. It brings up a lot of social anxiety. It brings up, especially we’re in a mastermind, a high-end mastermind. And it has myself worrying and comparing and having a lot, like I said, of anxiety around it.

And I think for those people that haven’t experienced a lot, they’re like, “Why would this be a problem? Why is this such an issue?” But for me, I’m really paying attention because I haven’t had it for a while. But this year it just came raging back, is noticing how much it takes me away from the work that I want to be doing or the energy and the brain space that I want to do.

And so, learning, for me, how to acknowledge right away when it is some iteration of, I don’t belong, that is my red flag that it’s like, oh. Now because I’ve done so much work around it and I think that’s the thing. It’s like we don’t always need to go into all the models and all of the core wounds and talking to your inner child. I’ve done that shit. I’ve done that shit for years. And so it’s like now it’s really just a practice of like seeing, “Oh, there it is again. Oh, here it is.”

The red flags for me is any iteration of I’m not belonging, I’m alone in here. Nobody likes me. Everybody hates me, I should go eat worms. Any of that kind of stuff. I’m like, “Oh, Danielle, what are you doing? You’re really not focusing on creating the dream that you’re set out to do.”

Now, for me, it’s just I know it is my brain’s way of sabotaging my inevitable success. That it’s like the minute that that’s coming in, my brain is like, “Ooh, she’s feeling too good about herself. She’s really on the right track. Time for the annihilation. Let’s bring in the big guns, let’s remind her all the ways she doesn’t belong.”

And so now, seeing that it’s really just a decoy from me focusing and working on the things that I want to be working on. Working on the creativity, using my mental energy for that, then I can just be like, “Oh, baby girl, of course you’re feeling that way. And I love you, but remember, we do belong. We belong anywhere we show up.”

And just bringing back that self-compassion and that kindness, and coming back in. Letting myself really find refuge and safety in my own body and reminding myself that I belong. Which, again, is so helpful to have friends, because you can literally just call them and be like, “Hi.” And they’re like, “Hey, I love you.” And you’re like, “See? See brain, They texted back. You belong, you’re fine.”

Lindsay: Yes. So I actually just had a thought when you were saying that. But first I want to say, before I go there, that for people that are listening that also have this thought, this I don’t belong, I think that it’s so important to hear what you just said. And to also just consider, like when you find your people, when you find the other people who are in your corner that you’re like, “Okay, I love these people. I really trust them.”

I think at least my experiencing it from the outside, one thing that I am interpret as being very helpful for you is that we very openly talk about it. Like I will ask you, because you’ve told me right that this is your thought. And I will actually just ask you like, “Well, do you have thoughts like that about me? Do you think I’m thinking those things?”

It always makes you kind of laugh, but then you’re like, “I mean, it crosses my mind.” Which is where I’m like, “Okay, well, this is how we know.”

Danielle: It’s sure not true.

Lindsay: They’re just thoughts. It doesn’t make it less painful, but it completely prevents me from even being in the pool with you at all. Because in my mind, I know what I think about you, I know how I feel about you. And I’m like, “Okay, well, that’s 0% true, what you’re thinking right now. So here we are and I just love you and we’re going to get through it.”

Danielle: Yes. Yeah, and I think that is such a good point. It’s just a reminder from those trusted friends that are like, “I love you. I got you. I haven’t thought that.” And to remind your brain like, “See, you’re being a little bit crazy right now. And I love the crazy, but let’s come back. Let’s come back here to this place that’s real and safe and so loving.”

Lindsay: Yeah. Okay, so I’ve just never thought of it like that. And I’m just curious, you have a lot more experience in this area than I do.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: As far as the actual brain side of it. And I’m just wondering, do you think that that happens because when you’re doing big things, when you are making big moves, when you’re making a lot of money, building your business, doing all the things, and you’re about to do something that is potentially very scary.

You’re doing something new and you don’t know. It may work, it may not work, but you’re going to try it anyway. And your brain, when it catches on, and this is probably a very overly simplified explanation, but it’s like “No, no, that discomfort we don’t know, so let’s just come back over here to the one we do.”

Danielle: Yeah, one thought, “I don’t belong.” Yeah. And I think that we all see this in different iterations. It’s always like that really kind of like I like to call it core wound, or one of your songs that you have on repeat that kind of like pull you to your knees. Anything like I’m not lovable. I’m not good enough. I’m not worthy. I don’t belong. These kind of painful stories, when we get to a certain level I think of resilience and courage and doing big things. We get used to the smaller thoughts, right? We’re like, “Oh, okay brain. And anyway, I’m doing this.”

So we get used to that as coaches, that becomes very, very strong. But it’s like when in the big leap it talks about when you reach to the point where your brain is like this is the limit of how big I can think, or how big I can dream or whatever. And there’s so many explanations of the way that we sabotage that kind of next level.

And I think for me, and especially in the last few weeks, like my IG got shut down, that was really hard for me. It’s something that I spent a lot of work on over the last decade. As a professional coach for the last six years it’s been my vehicle for business. Almost 25,000 followers, a lot of energy, and value, and content, and my ideas, and my personal feelings, all of that poured into that. And that got shut down.

And yes, it was heartbreaking. Also there was this knowing inside of me, this is the catalyst for something bigger. And it felt so big. I talked to Lindsay right after it happened, she was like, “I can hear it.” This, to me, felt like such a huge turning point of when stuff is about to blow up. I don’t know how but it’s like I felt it.

And then within a week afterwards, it was just this crushing feeling of I don’t belong, that just kind of brought me back and brought me away from this. Knowing deep inside and this feeling of everything is working in my favor, the universe has my back. And I know this is going to my business, my thought leadership, everything is going to take it to the next level.

And, of course, this old story that is my most painful story is going to show up now. Of course, because my brain is way more used to that story even though it’s painful. Even though it’s suffering, than this one of uncertainty and the fear and the discomfort of really feeling so inevitable in the dream that you’re trying to create.

It’s like yeah, but all these other things could be scary that we have to do along the way and all of that. And it’s like, oh, we know that she’s so in touch with the inevitability of this, these thoughts aren’t going to work for her. Because I think I had those and I was like, “Nope, thanks brain. But this is it, we’re doing this, it’s fine. We don’t have to know the how.”

But you bring in the belonging story, it’s like I just feel like these little characters. Like, “Okay, we couldn’t get her with that.” Like minions or something. Like, “Time to bring in the big guns, let’s bring in the I don’t belong, that one always gets her.”

Lindsay: It works every time.

Danielle: Every time.

Lindsay: And then they’re like, “Lindsay’s having a busy week so she’s really screwed this time.”

Danielle: Yeah. Let’s get her now. But I can see that and it’s so beautiful to see that. And I think it’s really important for us to pay attention not just to win these old stories, even if yours isn’t the belonging one, but these really very painful stories come up. And could it actually be a sign for you that you’re exactly on the right path?

That of course it’s going to come up in this moment and we don’t have to hang out there, we can come back. But it is such a good sign that you’re on to bigger things.

Lindsay: Yes. Oh my gosh. One thing that I talked about with some of the women in my mastermind recently, we just kind of had a post going about it and belonging had come up on one of the calls. And I’d posted something I just kind of had a thought that was like when I think about my friends, my best friends. Like you, kind of our friend group, or any other friends that I’ve had in my life, I think about yes, I love you because we have similarities, for sure. But I love you most because of things that are so different from me.

Those are the things that make it fun. Those are the things that make you interesting. If we were all exactly the same, how boring would that be? And also, we’d all be like, “Well, none of us belong. So I guess we can’t ever be friends.

Danielle: We’re all here not belonging together.

Lindsay: Yeah, or you could be like me and be like, “It’s fine, I don’t need anyone.” And then, again, just none of us would be friends. What are your thoughts about that?

I think belonging is like the comfort to be yourself. It’s like I think some people get confused that belonging means you have to fit in. And I think it’s just like no, you’re comfortable being who you are and taking up the space in whatever group that you’re in.

Danielle: Yeah, yeah. I mean, I totally agree. I think it’s so much more fun to have friends that have differences because we get to giggle about them too. I think you can bring a lightness and a totally different perspective just to my beliefs and my thoughts because you don’t have them at all.

Lindsay: Yep.

Danielle:  And I think that’s something that’s so beautiful, when you have friends that especially in our struggles, when we have completely different ones, it’s way easier as the one that has the thought. It’s easier to kind of have some lightness to it and almost laugh a little bit at yourself about it because you can see how asinine it seems to your friend. And vice versa.

You can hold that space and not really be in the pool at all with these kind of other things that you know each other have. Because you’re just like, “That’s not one of my pain points. I got you. You can get through this.”

Lindsay: It’s actually way more fun if you think about it. Like maybe a few years ago, although it turns out we’ve only known each other like three years. Which really just blows my mind. You just shared this with me, what yesterday? And I was like, “That’s not true.”

Danielle: No, surely we’ve been friends for a lifetime. No, less than three years. I can’t even, like that doesn’t make sense.

Lindsay: And we met in Cabo.

Danielle: Yep, and here we are again.

Lindsay: This is like full circle. Here we are, recording this podcast. But remember when we used to text each other and we were like, “I’m certainly never signing a client again.” And you were like, “Yeah, same.” And then it would just be like, “Okay, well, here we are.”

Danielle: Here we are. Yeah. And I think that’s fine at the beginning. Claire, who’s one of our close friends too, her and I have been friends for like six years now. And when we first joined, well, now it’s 2K for 2K, but it was Diva Business School when we first joined.

I just remember we would call each other and she’s like, “We’re never going to make any money.” And I was like, “I know.” But then we were like, “What if we were?” And then one of us would kind of pull out of the depths of despair for a moment and be like, “Do you remember, this so and so said this?” We’re like, “Yeah, I think that’s the thing that applies.”

So it’s fine at the beginning, like you’re not expecting anything. It’s just to be seen, I think. That’s the point, is to be fully seen in your insecurity, in your doubt, in your worry, in whatever. And as you’re doing that, as you have a place to be vulnerable and be safe there’s so much more growth there.

There’s so much more juiciness and the ability to be like, hey, if I can be seen in this thing that feels the most shameful, then you know you’re growing. You know you’re creating more resilience and courage and everything else. Because the path of discomfort is the path to growth.

Lindsay: Of course, yeah. And it’s always fine, let’s be clear, at any stage, at any level, at any whatever it’s always fine to share similar thoughts with your friends. It can be very comforting.

Which is kind of another thing we were going to maybe talk about today, which is I think one of the most amazing things about having close friends who are kind of in the same – What is the saying? Like the people in the same arena or whatever it is. It’s like we’re in the arena together. And sometimes it’s really nice to be like, “Oh my gosh, you have that thought too? Okay, well, here we are, just being normal, having human brains.

Danielle: Yeah. That feeling of not being alone, right? So it’s like, I think, sometimes we put the I’m belonging in the same camp as I’m not alone. And I don’t think these are the same story at all.

I think that these are very different tracks in our brain. Because the I’m alone in this is like a different type of suffering. It’s not like, “Oh, I don’t belong here.” It’s just you’ve already put yourself on this island and really created what everybody else has done.

Whether it’s their revenue, or their business, or something with their family, and you put it to yourself. You’ve isolated yourself on this island of like, what they’ve created isn’t possible for me. And that’s, I feel, like a totally different thing and exactly what you’re saying, it’s so important when we’re saying like, “Oh, I’m the only one that has these crazy thoughts about myself or all these insecurity.”

And especially being in the mastermind that we’re in, and you see people’s thought downloads, you peer coach them, and you talk to them and you’re like, “Oh my god, they do too even at the level that they’re at or I’m at.” or whatever it is, It allows yourself to have more compassion for your own brain and your own thoughts and everything that you’re going through.

Lindsay: Yes. One of my favorite things sometimes with my clients is when they come with this story that’s just so heavy to them. And it’s just like, “I just don’t even know sometimes I think I’m a terrible coach.” Just like, on and on. And I’m like, “Yeah, me too.”

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: They’re like, “What?”

Danielle: You couldn’t possibly think that.

Lindsay: Yeah, because I think that people think, our clients think I hear this all the time. And you and I’ve talked about also having this thought in a little bit different way. But it’s like, “Oh, but when you’re making more money those things just don’t come up for you anymore.” Or it’s somehow easier to work yourself out of it, to like work through it. Like, “Okay, okay, okay. I mean, it’s fine you’re having drama about not hitting your goal, but also it’s way easier because you have money.”

Danielle: And you’re not broke.

Lindsay: Which we know is not true at all. It feels exactly the same. And for those of you that are listening, they’re lies. I promise you, I mean, money is amazing. And it can be very helpful, but it certainly does not change all of the things that you are certain it’s going to change.

Danielle: Totally. And I think this is so evident for some of our mastermind sisters that have hit over the million dollar mark.

Lindsay: Mm-hmm.

Danielle: And those thoughts are still there and they’re like, “Oh, okay.” So I think that it’s actually the circumstance of like, “No, no, no, no, but if I had this kind of money in my bank account I would for sure, feel safe. I mean, how could I not?” And you’re like, “Oh, it’s not true at all.”

Lindsay: Yes. And then I hear them talk about things like their monthly business expenses. I’m like, “Oh, yeah, that’ll bring on a whole nother set of thoughts.” My monthly expenses are probably a lot for some people. But then I talked to someone who’s making millions and I’m like, “What? A month? What in the world?”

Danielle: Yeah, a month? Like I never even made that in a whole year and that’s how much is going out the door? That would freak me out. Yeah, the level of responsibility increases the more money you make. Whether it’s employees that you’re hiring, contractors that you’re paying, things that you have committed to, like advertising or PR agency, or anything else. It’s money out the door that you are responsible for and committed. So it’s like that pressure to also bring that in, increases. I mean, pressure only if you have thoughts that are pressuring you.

Lindsay: It doesn’t have to increase, right.

Danielle: But it can.

Lindsay: Yeah. Well that really is a thing where it’s like, I mean, it just comes down to you’d have to make different choices, maybe. You might have to make some hard choices, or maybe even hard technically is a thought. But uncomfortable, you might have to make some uncomfortable choices when you have that much money going out. And if you don’t have it coming in.

Danielle: Right, totally.

Lindsay: Okay, so I want to circle back for a second to kind of touch on this one last thing about belonging. So for you, just because I know this comes up for so many people and I know this is going to be so, so useful. So I’m extremely grateful for you talking about this.

What do you do when you’re in a situation where it is new? Like you don’t have me there. You don’t have your best friends there. You don’t have someone who you’re like, “Okay, I’m having the thought I don’t belong. But I know it’s not really true because I talked to Lindsay and she says I do so we’re fine.”

But when that’s not available, it’s like it’s something new. You joined a new thing. You’re at a retreat and you don’t know anyone. Wherever it is, what are your tools? What do you use when you’re in that situation?

Danielle: Yeah, I have a lot of tools. Because, like I said, this has been my lifelong growth and really just yummy opportunity for continuing to get to know myself better. But one of the first things that I always remind myself is I belong, because I’m here, period. Bottom line, that is one thought that’s always helped me is because I’ve decided to show up and these other people showed up. We both made the same decision, that is factually true. So that does give me a sense of belonging.

Another thing that I’ve done is just write all of the reasons down that I belong. Like make my brain go to the place of why do you belong in this group? Why do you belong in this room? And it might be something like because I applied and I made the requirements for it. Because I also want to grow in this area, because I also really love to dance and shake my booty, right? Depending on what room we’re talking about here.

Lindsay: Yeah, you’ve been in some interesting rooms where I for sure might be like, “I actually don’t belong here.”

Danielle: Yes, I’ve been in a lot of very fascinating rooms where somebody from the outside would be like, “That girl definitely doesn’t belong.” They might have that thought about me, but I’ve done this on purpose. I’ve consistently put myself in rooms where this thought comes up. Because every time I face it I learn something new about myself, I get to create more trust with myself and more of this sense of belonging.

But helping yourself, even if it’s something like a wedding or a birthday party, like of course I belong because we both love these people that are getting married. Or because of course I want to celebrate this person that I grew up with, right? We can find that evidence to say why we belong, that is helpful.

And so that’s one way, the other thing that I like to do is continuously – Because of my work I always talk about coming back home to the body. And I really love that feeling of like, yes, it’s actually a homecoming. When you learn how to drop out of your head and into your body, and you’ve created such a beautiful, safe, loving, juicy affair between you and your body, it is a refuge.

And so when you might feel like you don’t belong out there, you’re still in your body. You can always come back to your body and you’re like, “I am here. I belong here. I belong wherever my body is.” So it’s like of course you’re going to belong in different rooms because you’re at home with yourself.

And when you can keep coming back at home with yourself, especially dropping into your body and your senses, then that also allows you to drop away from all of the mental chatter that’s creating the pain and the suffering in the first place.

So I would say those are kind of my top three places to go to when I’m really feeling that. Especially when it’s completely new and different situations.

Lindsay: Yeah, I love that. I think too, one thing that I just thought of that I want to be really clear about, and I think that you would agree, is that some people that are listening, if they’ve been in situations where they’ve actually been told they don’t belong, or where people are being intentionally hurtful to them, or anything like that. I just want to be clear that what we’re talking about is situations where you have decided you want to be there and you want to belong.

Danielle: Yes.

Lindsay: Which is very different than the other. That’s like a totally different topic and this is not like just convincing yourself you belong somewhere that you don’t actually want to be.

Danielle: Yeah, and I would even go sometimes you also need to be aware when there is situations that you don’t actually belong in that room, and you’re trying to. Like you’re trying really hard and somebody else is letting you know this isn’t your space. That also, I don’t think that we’re talking about either. It’s not like well, because I’ve decided and it’s like this righteousness. And I’ve also had suffering and I also duh, duh, duh so I get what you’re saying.

We’re not talking about that and forcing yourself to feel like you belong in places where you don’t belong part of particular conversations or particular rooms. We’re really talking about stuff that’s –

Lindsay: When you know it’s your thoughts.

Danielle: Yes.

Lindsay: Even if it feels so true and so painful. But you know that there’s this like, “Uh-huh and I want to be here. I am accepted here.” Like everything else is on the outside good, and you are just having thoughts that are like, “I don’t belong here.” I don’t, whatever, fill in the blank.

Danielle: Yeah, you don’t feel deserving, that’s really what we’re talking about. I mean, I can bring up so many different examples. But if you’re going to a recovering from cancer group and you’ve never had cancer or any kind of illness and you’re like, “No, but I belong because I’ve had a cold before.” It’s like this is not the space for you, actually.

Lindsay: Yes. Yes, yes, yes. It seems like the rule is like if your safety is compromised –  And when I say safety, I mean, if you are compromising the safety of others, which the example you just gave would be like people wouldn’t feel safe in that space to maybe share their thing with someone who’s like, “I have no idea.” Like they’re comparing a cold to cancer for example, right?

Danielle: Yeah. Or like if a man, like a heterosexual man tried to join my better sex in 90 days program who was born male –

Lindsay: Oh yeah, you have so many examples of this.

Danielle: And wants to explain their opinion. You know, born a man with male genitalia, socialized as a man, grew up with male privileges and then wants to join particular conversations about women’s pleasure. I was like, This is not the room for you, thank you.

Lindsay: Yes.

Danielle: There’s the door.

Lindsay: Oh my goodness. Listen, one of the perks of being Danielle’s best friend is hearing some crazy stories that we can just laugh over and be like, “What is wrong with people? What is even happening?”

Danielle: How many D pics can she get in a week?

Lindsay: So can I buy it for my wife?

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: Does she want it?

Danielle: Is this something she’s interested in? Have you had this conversation with her?

Lindsay: I don’t feel like gifting Better Se in 90 Days is probably a good move, husbands.

Danielle: Well actually, I think there is some situations because some of the women that have been in it, their husbands have gifted it for them. But it was a conversation because they know and it was this loving place and I know you want this and I would love to do this.

Lindsay: Right, very different.

Danielle: Versus there’s something wrong with my wife. I’m going to buy this for her so I can fix her.

Lindsay: And surprise her.

Danielle: Yeah, and I was like, “No, that’s different.”

Lindsay: No, no, no, no. Okay, we got a little sidetracked. I thought it was important. I thought it was important to talk about the difference in what we were saying and then, of course, some funny stories about Better Sex in 90 Days is always good.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: So let’s circle back to what you said about Instagram.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: Which I want to be clear for everyone listening. What happened is actually kind of crazy. I feel like this is a fact, not Danielle’s thoughts. She just got kicked off of Instagram for talking about sex.

Danielle: They disabled my account.

Lindsay: Yes. Yep. And, I mean, if you have followed her on Instagram you know there’s no reason for this. She was not doing anything inappropriate or, I mean, maybe that’s my opinion.

Danielle: Soliciting sexual services? Give me a break.

Lindsay: Right. So you got completely kicked off of Instagram, you’re not even there. I searched you actually earlier today and your name doesn’t even come up.

Danielle: You can’t even tag me in our pretty pictures and stories.

Lindsay: I know.

Danielle: I’ll still be in there. I think you might be able to like tag me and then maybe you can put my name on there. But if you go to that account it will be like, “Account not found.”

Lindsay: Well I don’t want to be disabled.

Danielle: For being associated with me?

Lindsay: That’s right, we’re bad characters.

Danielle: By association.

Danielle: Okay, we’re joking but this is actually a kind of big deal for your business, right? Like it’s a platform that you have used for quite a long time, you have a much larger following than I do than most people do. Let’s just go there for a second. First of all, what was the first thing that happened in your brain when that happened?

Danielle: The first thing that happened, I was like, “Surely this is a mistake. What is going on? I must have just used the wrong login.” Even though obviously, my passwords are changed.

And then I got onto Voxer because I talk with my assistant on Voxer and she was like, “Where’s your Instagram?” And I was like, “Oh, that’s surreal.” And then I went into my husband’s office, which is like four feet away, walked out the door, walked into his. Told him, bawled, crawled in his lap, got a hug. Wiped my tears, came back to my office.

And I was like, “Okay.” And then I kind of just like calmed my nervous system down for a minute. I was like, “Okay, so this is a thing, what do I do?” So the first thing I did just calm like, researched it. I posted about it in our mastermind. Somebody else had shared with me that their account got disabled for a couple of days.

Did more research, especially around sex educators. Because sex educators, you know, this is a place where it is different, right? I don’t have to feel alone in this, but when I’m in a mastermind where there is other sex educators, it’s like I need to go and look at what other sex educators or sex coaches or those kinds of things.

Because when it comes to social media there is a difference about talking about money or business coaching, or any of these other things. This doesn’t have to be a negative thing, but for us to deny that there is a difference is just ludicrous because it is different.

We live in a patriarchal system that really has a hard time talking about sex in a way that’s really honoring and educating women on their own pleasure rather than seeing us as objects of pleasure and desire. Which seems to be fine on the social media.

If I wanted to post more provocative and naked. And even though those accounts also have been focused on, that still would be less of a trigger or red flag for them to shut down my account versus me actually speaking to central pleasure, for female pleasure, for this liberation and owning of our own pleasure.

So I researched it and it happens a lot. And I knew that it happened a lot, I heard about it. I knew that there was risk in it. Every single time I posted it wasn’t just like, “Do I feel courageous enough to post it because I want to be seen in this, or I’m talking about this, or this is kind of a taboo topic?” But it was knowing very well that I could be shut down at any time.

And there is part of me that knew that and kind of wanted to ignore that. And then the other part of me that’s like, “I owe it to my audience and to the people that have chosen to trust me to keep talking into this. To keep speaking the truth. To not beat around the bush.” Pun totally intended.

So, I really do think that it was something that I knew that there was a risk in, but I was also willing to take that risk for the women of the world and for the audience. And there was grief after I –  It lit this fire in me first, it lit this fire of and this is exactly why I care about this.

And this is exactly why I have to talk to this. And this is exactly why women don’t feel as safe in their own sexual pleasure. They do not feel liberated, do not feel that this is an important part of them. Because it’s literally been shut down, like now in modern times and historically forever.

So that just re-solidified my why for me, just from a human place. It was heartbreaking. I don’t have a lot of backup, I haven’t written this stuff and then post it on Instagram. Instagram, I’ve been on for 10 years. When I first started it was when I was in a very vulnerable time of my life. I was facing a lot of health issues, including cancer. I wrote about it. I poured my heart into Instagram like it was my journal.

That’s how I first got my first few followers was following this very raw and honest journey. And to have all of that – Oh, it’s going to make me emotional. To have all of that gone, it’s hard. Like I want to be able to revisit places that I’ve been over this last decade, and the writing, and the intellectual property that I’ve created.

Even if I’m not able to be back on it, or have my account back there from a business standpoint, it’s like, can you please just give me my scrapbook back? And I think we all know when we get on this that we don’t actually own it. But there is an illusion that it’s yours. And so I think that’s been like the part that’s been harder, is just losing that work.

And so business wise, it’s like the place that I’ve come to, like I said, is like I know this is a turning point for me. I know, we’re going to be talking on here someday about some bigger way that I’ve shown up in the world. And this was the turning point. I know that deep down in my soul and in my heart. And it also allowed me to get really honest with myself about my relationship with Instagram.

I’ve always felt like I have good boundaries. It’s not like I’m checking it during dinner time or thinking about it all of the time. But what am I not creating when I’m creating content for Instagram? Like I want to write a book. I started a book proposal, I’m not working on that. I’m not working on my certification program for other coaches to be able to be certified in my process for that mind, body, and central connection. I’m not working on creating more beautiful assets for the women in Better Sex in 90 Days.

There’s all these other things that I’m not doing when I’m spending time creating for Instagram. That being said, I don’t regret one minute of it. Because Instagram allowed me to find my voice. It allowed me to become courageous. It allowed me to be raw and honest and be seen. It helped me believe that women really wanted this. So there’s so many beautiful things that have come out of it. And if it’s done, then it’s done. And I’m so excited for what’s next.

Lindsay: I’m so grateful for you sharing that. And I can’t imagine, this is just me being your friend. This is a good example of just like, I just really can’t imagine that – You know, we do take stuff like that for granted and the posting and the putting all of our stuff there and just assuming it’s always going to be there for our finding again.

And like you said, it was like your journal and it’s almost like a very intimate space for you from those times. And I can’t imagine how hard that piece would be for sure.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: And from a business perspective. So on the other side of it I think one reason I really wanted to talk about this and to bring it up today is because for everybody listening no matter what, it doesn’t matter what kind of coach they are. Whether it’s an Instagram, whether it’s Facebook ads, whether it’s a blog, or YouTube, or in person events.

Whatever it is that they’re relying on and thinking like, “Oh, this is the way. This is the right way, this is where I’m going to focus all of my attention.” It’s so important to think about that and to really think – This is true for all of us. What if all of a sudden social media was just gone? What if YouTube was gone?

Danielle: Do I write a letter? Do I knock on people’s doors?

Lindsay: Who do I tell?

Danielle: How do I let them know that Better Se in 90 Days is open? A banner?

Lindsay: Flyers on cars. That’s what I always tell my clients when they’re really stuck. I’m like, “I don’t know.”

Danielle: Signs in Vegas.

Lindsay: Yeah, billboards. But I think something that’s just so important about that is just to notice, and not saying that this is exactly what you were doing. But I just have so many people who come to me that are like, “Okay, I like know how to coach and I learned this and I learned this.”

And they come to me thinking I’m going to teach them a totally new way of coaching. Like it’s going to blow their mind, it’s going to be something they’ve never ever heard before. Partially that might be true sometimes, depending on where they learned to coach.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: But for the most part, what I do is I tell them, “Listen, there is no right way. And we’re going to figure out your way.” And I think that’s kind of exactly what’s happening for you.

It’s like we get so used to searching for what’s the right way? Could someone just tell me the right way so I’m guaranteed it will work?

Danielle: Yes.

Lindsay: And you and I have someone in our mastermind, who is our good friend and one of our mastermind sisters is like, “Listen guys, Instagram, you have to build your business on Instagram, you have to do reels.”

Danielle: This is how you do it.

Lindsay: Yeah. And it’s great. It was all amazing advice. And also, there is the possibility you put all of that time and effort, and you were doing reels, not because of her, but you were doing reels every day.

Danielle: Way before, yeah.

Lindsay: And now it’s just none of it’s there anymore.

Danielle: Nope.

Lindsay: But I think that the beauty in it, which we’ve talked about, which is like I know that you can see it a little bit. And I’m sure there’s also the side of you that’s like, “F all of you, this is stupid.”

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: But the beauty in it, I think, is really like, Uh-huh, and what are the hundred other ways that this is going to work? What if it’s not the one right way? And I’ve already seen, because we’ve talked about it, it really has forced you to say like, “Okay, how else is it going to work?” Like really open your mind to what are all the other possibilities?

Danielle: Totally. And I think what’s so important is you can even hear it in my emotions talking about it. You can’t go to the how and the problem solving and all of that right away. It was really important and it still continues to be. Now, because it’s been 14 days since it’s been disabled, I have gone through a lot of emotions. There’s certain things that still come up, but not like forcing. It’s like you don’t want to be reactive, “Okay, now what? What do I do next? How do I do it?”

And I really was very intentional about not doing that. I was so intentional of like, I don’t have to like jump ship, and be like, “Okay, well now it’s YouTube or now it’s writing something.” Or whatever it was, it was just like, Okay, this is where we’re at now. I’m not actually making any decisions from this place. I really just need to remind myself that everything that I want to create is possible, period. That is my work right now to keep coming back to that inevitability. And that possibility, that certainty, and that groundedness in my body.

And now because I’ve given myself two full weeks to really not be super reactive and graspy and like, “I got to keep marketing, I got to keep making sure everybody knows all this stuff.” I could get on Facebook and do all the stuff that I was doing on Instagram to some extent. And I haven’t done that at all.

And the reason is, is because I don’t want to do something out of a reactive place of like, “Oh, now this. And oh, this.” It’s like I really just want to get grounded and trusting that what I want to create is totally possible. And I know that the more juicy ideas about my next right step will come to me from this place. They’re never going to come to me out of a place of reactivity.

Lindsay: Oh my gosh, yes. I see this in my clients too. It’s like no matter what you’re doing when you’re believing like, “Oh my gosh, there’s one right way.” And it’s this very graspy energy of, “I just have to figure it out.”

I see it with my clients even. They’ll explain to me about a coaching session and they’re like, “Well, first I tried this.” And I’m like, “Okay, what happened?” And they’re like, “Well, nothing and so then I panicked. And then I like moved to this other and I tried this thing. And then I tried this other thing.”

And it’s like, “Whoa, slow down. You have forgotten in all of this that the most important thing right now is what is your client thinking? How are they feeling? Like, bring it back. Let’s just check in.” And that’s exactly what you’re saying. I mean, that’s always the process, right? Bring it back, check in, slow down.

Danielle: It’s the urge of action. It’s like these urges, like we talked about these urges.

Lindsay: Well it just feels so much better, right? It’s like, what are you going to do about it?

Danielle: Right, what am I going to do? And I feel like taking particular actions would have maybe in the short term quelled my fear and my doubt. But I’ve given myself so much permission to actually be with the fear and the doubt and not follow through. Let the wave, like I call it the urge wave that we follow through when we’re being mindful in our body. Because it really is like this wave.

It’s like you feel it in your body, you feel this graspyness, you feel this pull and then it goes away. And I can come back and letting those urges to take action settle and just be like that’s not where action is needing to come from right now at all. If I am taking any action, it’s going to be from a grounded place and giving myself space to get there before jumping to whatever is next.

Lindsay: Yes, I love it. Okay, I think we should wrap this up because you and I could talk for seven hours at least.

Danielle: I’m like how many episodes did you say?

Lindsay: And we have plans tonight so we have to get going and everyone could just like wish that they were here with us having all of the fun. Is there anything else, we’ll get to where can people find you because right now it’s not Instagram. Hopefully, if they’re listening in the future you’re back and you are doing it. But maybe not. But is there anything else before we do that, that you want to talk about?

Danielle: Well, the only thing that I would want to say is if any of this stuff is landing for you and you’re resonating with, which I’m sure it is because we’re all human. It’s really that reminder to be not ever looking at other people that might be in the coaching world and assuming they are immune to being a human being.

We are all human. We all have our doubts. We all have our insecurities. Whether it’s your not belonging story, but the way that you can help yourself just belong in the coaching industry and in this world is to not other yourself from the other coaches thinking that everything that you’re thinking, they for sure don’t have those doubts. They for sure don’t have those thoughts. They for sure don’t have these worries, or obstacles, or anything like that. Be like, “Oh, of course, we’re all facing this stuff.”

Giving yourself that safety and that compassion is really going to just help solidify that trust as you’re going through that process. As you’re connecting with colleagues and friends that will also be able to see that in you. But even just right now, just really coming back to putting your hand on your heart and being like, “Yeah, and me too.”

Lindsay: Yes, yes, yes. Yes. I love that. Okay, with that being said, where can people find you?

Danielle: In my hotel room. Great question. No, I’ll drop a link. I think the best thing and the thing that I’ve been really encouraging people on my own podcast, on my podcast It’s My Pleasure, you can listen to me there.

But also just my email list. That’s the one thing I more likely own even if I don’t own this platform. I feel like there’s a bit more safety even if I have my list. I can take my list to other places. So we will drop the link on that if you want to get on my email list where now I’ve been putting a lot more of my writings, my musings, my practices, sharing meditations with my email list.

So that’s the best way.

Lindsay: And we’ll put a link but if they just wanted to go do it is it just daniellesavory.com?

Danielle: Yeah, there’s something about like –  I’m working on my website right now. But right now I think it’s like join my mailing list or Hot Tips or something like that. So you just click on that.

Lindsay: Listen, my listeners are really smart. I feel like they are going to know, they’re going to figure it out. If they want to find you nothing can hold them back. They’re going to find you.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay:  All right, thank you so much. This was so fun and I can’t wait to see you in like an hour.

Danielle: Great idea, you were like, “Hey,” texting me, “Want to do a podcast today?” I was like, “Yeah, let’s do it.”

Lindsay: I know. Can we just get like, side note, we’re in Mexico and we’ve just been in our hotel rooms resting.

Danielle: All day.

Lindsay: I took some personal days last week and so I’ve been actually kind of catching up on some things. But also still just resting and just being. Just being, and that’s what you’ve been doing.

Danielle: Yeah, organizing my shoes. It was like oh, this feels so good. I like color coordinated my dresses in my closet. I was like, “This is the best day ever, I just needed a day like this.”

Lindsay: We all need that day sometimes.

Danielle: Yeah.

Lindsay: And when you got on here, I said I’ve been getting some work done. And you said I’ve been doing nothing. And I was like, “No, no. You’ve been doing all the things.” Sometimes doing those things and really resting and really taking care of yourself –

Danielle: Is everything.

Lindsay:  Which of course I said that and you were like, “Yes, you’re totally right.” And you knew it but that’s just always our go to as humans. It’s just like, “Oh, I got nothing done today.” And that’s not true, resting is actually getting something done. We’ll talk about that next time.

Danielle: Totally, totally.

Lindsay: All right.

Danielle: Okay, love you. Thanks for having me.

Lindsay: Love you. See you later.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Mastering Coaching Skills. If you want to learn more about my work, come visit me at lindsaydotzlafcoaching.com. That’s Lindsay with an A, D-O-T-Z-L-A-F.com. see you next week.